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| Junior doctors row: hospital bosses back doctors over Hunt - Politics live | Junior doctors row: hospital bosses back doctors over Hunt - Politics live |
| (4 days later) | |
| 7.23pm GMT | 7.23pm GMT |
| 19:23 | 19:23 |
| Meanwhile a petition to parliament calling on Jeremy Hunt to resume meaningful contract negotiations with the BMA has passed 5,000 signatories, and that number is rising quickly. | Meanwhile a petition to parliament calling on Jeremy Hunt to resume meaningful contract negotiations with the BMA has passed 5,000 signatories, and that number is rising quickly. |
| When it reaches 10,000 the government must respond to the petition; should it reach 100,000 signatories, it will be considered for debate in parliament. | When it reaches 10,000 the government must respond to the petition; should it reach 100,000 signatories, it will be considered for debate in parliament. |
| The petition says: “J. Hunt is to impose a new contract. As incoming junior doctors, with GMC registration, starting work as an FY1 in August 2016 and junior doctors working within the NHS we will refuse to sign the imposed contract and will continue strike action on behalf of the medical profession and greater public.” | The petition says: “J. Hunt is to impose a new contract. As incoming junior doctors, with GMC registration, starting work as an FY1 in August 2016 and junior doctors working within the NHS we will refuse to sign the imposed contract and will continue strike action on behalf of the medical profession and greater public.” |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.26pm GMT | at 7.26pm GMT |
| 7.17pm GMT | 7.17pm GMT |
| 19:17 | 19:17 |
| Chris Johnston | Chris Johnston |
| Outside the Department of Health headquarters, Glenys Arlidge, a junior doctor in a London A&E department, said Jeremy Hunt denigrated the medical profession, did not understand the way hospitals operated or were structured or the vital role that others such as paramedics played in delivering emergency care in the UK. | Outside the Department of Health headquarters, Glenys Arlidge, a junior doctor in a London A&E department, said Jeremy Hunt denigrated the medical profession, did not understand the way hospitals operated or were structured or the vital role that others such as paramedics played in delivering emergency care in the UK. |
| “He should understand fully how things work - then he might be in a position to improve things. If that were the case he would have far more support from the profession.” | “He should understand fully how things work - then he might be in a position to improve things. If that were the case he would have far more support from the profession.” |
| She said Hunt had shown himself unwilling or unable to admit he didn’t properly understand junior doctors’ needs and as a result had put patients at risk. “That’s absolutely unforgivable. Patients should not be the ones to come to harm.” | She said Hunt had shown himself unwilling or unable to admit he didn’t properly understand junior doctors’ needs and as a result had put patients at risk. “That’s absolutely unforgivable. Patients should not be the ones to come to harm.” |
| Arlidge said she and her husband - also a junior doctor - who have a one-year-old son, often only had one weekend day a month when both were not working. | Arlidge said she and her husband - also a junior doctor - who have a one-year-old son, often only had one weekend day a month when both were not working. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 8.26pm GMT | at 8.26pm GMT |
| 7.04pm GMT | 7.04pm GMT |
| 19:04 | 19:04 |
| Chris Johnston | Chris Johnston |
| Heledd Vaterlaws, a junior doctor who qualified in Wales and has worked in a GP surgery in London for the past six years, was one of about 200 to 300 junior doctors and supporters gathered outside the Department of Health headquarters on Whitehall on Thursday night. | Heledd Vaterlaws, a junior doctor who qualified in Wales and has worked in a GP surgery in London for the past six years, was one of about 200 to 300 junior doctors and supporters gathered outside the Department of Health headquarters on Whitehall on Thursday night. |
| The crowd chanted slogans including “Jeremy Hunt has got to go” and “we won’t give up the fight”. | The crowd chanted slogans including “Jeremy Hunt has got to go” and “we won’t give up the fight”. |
| She said: “We all know that the fight is going to go on - we’re not going to give up now. The more Jeremy Hunt lies and spins this the more we are going to fight.” | She said: “We all know that the fight is going to go on - we’re not going to give up now. The more Jeremy Hunt lies and spins this the more we are going to fight.” |
| Vaterlaws said she and her colleagues were being forced to choose between their own health and wellbeing and that of their patients. She added that the idea that junior doctors would win pay rises under the new contract was wrong and stressed that, contrary to media reports, junior doctors were not paid overtime. | Vaterlaws said she and her colleagues were being forced to choose between their own health and wellbeing and that of their patients. She added that the idea that junior doctors would win pay rises under the new contract was wrong and stressed that, contrary to media reports, junior doctors were not paid overtime. |
| A true seven-day NHS was not realistic given existing staff levels, Vaterlaws said. Patients did not want to spend their Saturdays seeing their GP about minor complaints. | A true seven-day NHS was not realistic given existing staff levels, Vaterlaws said. Patients did not want to spend their Saturdays seeing their GP about minor complaints. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.23pm GMT | at 7.23pm GMT |
| 6.46pm GMT | 6.46pm GMT |
| 18:46 | 18:46 |
| What happens next? | What happens next? |
| Denis Campbell, health policy editor, writes: | Denis Campbell, health policy editor, writes: |
| After two months of talks during December and January there are no more negotiations planned. | After two months of talks during December and January there are no more negotiations planned. |
| NHS trusts in England will start imposing the new contract from the start of August, initially on the new cohort of medical graduates starting work in the NHS for the first time then. It is expected to take a year to get all 45,000 juniors onto the contract. | NHS trusts in England will start imposing the new contract from the start of August, initially on the new cohort of medical graduates starting work in the NHS for the first time then. It is expected to take a year to get all 45,000 juniors onto the contract. |
| The BMA responded to Hunt’s announcement by pledging to continue its fight against the contract. But it is so far given no details as to what that might involve and it is unclear what they can do. | The BMA responded to Hunt’s announcement by pledging to continue its fight against the contract. But it is so far given no details as to what that might involve and it is unclear what they can do. |
| They might seek to undertake further industrial action -- and possibly even stage an all-out strike. But while some members of the BMA’s junior doctors committee back that option, others, and the BMA’s leadership, believe that refusing to work in areas of emergency care, such as A&E and maternity services, could lead to patients being harmed or even killed, which would have disastrous consequences for doctors’ currently very high standing with the public. | They might seek to undertake further industrial action -- and possibly even stage an all-out strike. But while some members of the BMA’s junior doctors committee back that option, others, and the BMA’s leadership, believe that refusing to work in areas of emergency care, such as A&E and maternity services, could lead to patients being harmed or even killed, which would have disastrous consequences for doctors’ currently very high standing with the public. |
| The BMA is seeking legal advice as to whether the ballot result it got in November -- 98% backed strike action -- remains a legal basis for further walkouts or withdrawals of labour. If it is not, then they may have to stage a second ballot to give them a fresh mandate to strike. | The BMA is seeking legal advice as to whether the ballot result it got in November -- 98% backed strike action -- remains a legal basis for further walkouts or withdrawals of labour. If it is not, then they may have to stage a second ballot to give them a fresh mandate to strike. |
| 6.41pm GMT | 6.41pm GMT |
| 18:41 | 18:41 |
| Frances Perraudin | Frances Perraudin |
| Jack Dover, 24, a medical student at Manchester university, said his whole career would be affected by today’s decision.“I’ve been going at this for 4 and a half years now and I’ve got 18 months left to go,” he says.“My generation is the generation that has already been shafted by fees and now we’re coming out of university with all this debt and we’re being shafted by crappy working conditions as well.”Dover is in the last year of medical students in England and Wales to have £3,500 fees instead of having to pay £9,000 per year.“Because the contract is only for England, it’s really made me consider whether I want to go to one of their her parts of the UK. I wanted to stay in Manchester because I love it here,” he says.“I’ve got a choice between uprooting my whole life or working under a contract that means I will make mistakes because I’ll be so tired.” | Jack Dover, 24, a medical student at Manchester university, said his whole career would be affected by today’s decision.“I’ve been going at this for 4 and a half years now and I’ve got 18 months left to go,” he says.“My generation is the generation that has already been shafted by fees and now we’re coming out of university with all this debt and we’re being shafted by crappy working conditions as well.”Dover is in the last year of medical students in England and Wales to have £3,500 fees instead of having to pay £9,000 per year.“Because the contract is only for England, it’s really made me consider whether I want to go to one of their her parts of the UK. I wanted to stay in Manchester because I love it here,” he says.“I’ve got a choice between uprooting my whole life or working under a contract that means I will make mistakes because I’ll be so tired.” |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 6.41pm GMT | at 6.41pm GMT |
| 6.37pm GMT | 6.37pm GMT |
| 18:37 | 18:37 |
| Has Jeremy Hunt won? | Has Jeremy Hunt won? |
| Denis Campbell, health policy editor, writes: | Denis Campbell, health policy editor, writes: |
| Yes -- and no. The health secretary has got his way in that from August the 45,000 junior doctors in the NHS in England will start working under a contract that is, on key issues, very close to the one he first threatened to impose back in September. Usefully for him it is also a contract that, by forcing junior doctors to work on Saturdays more often, lets him claim that he has taken a major step forward to delivering the seven-day NHS promised in the Conservatives’ general election manifestio last year. | Yes -- and no. The health secretary has got his way in that from August the 45,000 junior doctors in the NHS in England will start working under a contract that is, on key issues, very close to the one he first threatened to impose back in September. Usefully for him it is also a contract that, by forcing junior doctors to work on Saturdays more often, lets him claim that he has taken a major step forward to delivering the seven-day NHS promised in the Conservatives’ general election manifestio last year. |
| It does that because it extends “plain time” -- the hours in the week for which junior doctors are paid at their basic rate -- in two key ways. First, it will now be extended from 7pm to 9pm between Monday and Friday. Secondly, and most importantly, given the significance of Saturday working for both sides, for the first time Saturdays between 7am and 5pm will now count as “plain time” for the first time. That will help hospital chief executives roster more junior doctors to work then without it increasing their running costs significantly and thus help bring about a seven-day NHS for which ministers have produced no extra money. | It does that because it extends “plain time” -- the hours in the week for which junior doctors are paid at their basic rate -- in two key ways. First, it will now be extended from 7pm to 9pm between Monday and Friday. Secondly, and most importantly, given the significance of Saturday working for both sides, for the first time Saturdays between 7am and 5pm will now count as “plain time” for the first time. That will help hospital chief executives roster more junior doctors to work then without it increasing their running costs significantly and thus help bring about a seven-day NHS for which ministers have produced no extra money. |
| But has Hunt convinced the public that his proposals are right? | But has Hunt convinced the public that his proposals are right? |
| Definitely not. Separate opinion polls this week, by Ipsos Mori and YouGov, found that those who back the junior doctors outnumber those who don’t by two to one. Imposing the contract is unlikely to reduce that strong public support for trainee medics. | Definitely not. Separate opinion polls this week, by Ipsos Mori and YouGov, found that those who back the junior doctors outnumber those who don’t by two to one. Imposing the contract is unlikely to reduce that strong public support for trainee medics. |
| More practically, Hunt’s move could also have serious consequences for the NHS in both the short and long-term. The main risk is that even more newly-qualified doctors will decide not to continue their career in protest at a contract they regard as unfair. The numbers choosing not to stay in the NHS and start specialist medical training has gone down for the last four years in a row. Many of the medical royal colleges -- bodies which represent different groups of doctors professionally -- have voiced serious unease about the prospect of that happening and thus worsening existing, sometimes serious, shortages of medical personnel. | More practically, Hunt’s move could also have serious consequences for the NHS in both the short and long-term. The main risk is that even more newly-qualified doctors will decide not to continue their career in protest at a contract they regard as unfair. The numbers choosing not to stay in the NHS and start specialist medical training has gone down for the last four years in a row. Many of the medical royal colleges -- bodies which represent different groups of doctors professionally -- have voiced serious unease about the prospect of that happening and thus worsening existing, sometimes serious, shortages of medical personnel. |
| 5.32pm GMT | 5.32pm GMT |
| 17:32 | 17:32 |
| And a seventh. | And a seventh. |
| Now 7 NHS chiefs - Sir Andrew Cash from @SheffieldHosp says he does not support imposition. He does support Dalton's deal #juniorcontract | Now 7 NHS chiefs - Sir Andrew Cash from @SheffieldHosp says he does not support imposition. He does support Dalton's deal #juniorcontract |
| 5.18pm GMT | 5.18pm GMT |
| 17:18 | 17:18 |
| And a sixth. Miles Scott, chief executive of St George’s Hospital Trust in south London, says he too does not support imposition. | And a sixth. Miles Scott, chief executive of St George’s Hospital Trust in south London, says he too does not support imposition. |
| To be clear, I supported the contract offer but not imposition. | To be clear, I supported the contract offer but not imposition. |
| 4.49pm GMT | 4.49pm GMT |
| 16:49 | 16:49 |
| Health Service Journal’s Shaun Lintern has uncovered another two NHS chief executives whose names are on a letter purporting to support the imposition of the contract, but who now say they do not support that measure. | Health Service Journal’s Shaun Lintern has uncovered another two NHS chief executives whose names are on a letter purporting to support the imposition of the contract, but who now say they do not support that measure. |
| That’s five - a quarter - of the original 20, which now includes David Sloman, chief executive of the Royal Free London NHS Trust, and David Loughton of Royal Wolverhampton Trust. | That’s five - a quarter - of the original 20, which now includes David Sloman, chief executive of the Royal Free London NHS Trust, and David Loughton of Royal Wolverhampton Trust. |
| Full statement from David Sloman: pic.twitter.com/RiQJ9XGX8T | Full statement from David Sloman: pic.twitter.com/RiQJ9XGX8T |
| Breaking: David Loughton of Royal Wolverhampton Trust clarifies he "does not support imposition" of #juniorcontractThat's five out of 20 | Breaking: David Loughton of Royal Wolverhampton Trust clarifies he "does not support imposition" of #juniorcontractThat's five out of 20 |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 4.49pm GMT | at 4.49pm GMT |
| 4.42pm GMT | 4.42pm GMT |
| 16:42 | 16:42 |
| Afternoon summary | Afternoon summary |
| Junior doctors cannot and will not accept a contract that is bad for the future of patient care, the profession and the NHS as a whole. | Junior doctors cannot and will not accept a contract that is bad for the future of patient care, the profession and the NHS as a whole. |
| You don’t know what you get paid? ... Out there, taxpayers, our constituents, are very angry, they live in a different world clearly to the world you live in, if you can’t even tell us what you are paid. | You don’t know what you get paid? ... Out there, taxpayers, our constituents, are very angry, they live in a different world clearly to the world you live in, if you can’t even tell us what you are paid. |
| What’s the word for this behaviour? Is it shabby, tawdry or just downright cynical?” | What’s the word for this behaviour? Is it shabby, tawdry or just downright cynical?” |
| The fact that we have made 86 recommendations shows that we think that part of the bill is flawed and needs to be looked at in greater detail. There is a lot of room for improvement. | The fact that we have made 86 recommendations shows that we think that part of the bill is flawed and needs to be looked at in greater detail. There is a lot of room for improvement. |
| 4.15pm GMT | 4.15pm GMT |
| 16:15 | 16:15 |
| Labour’s Andy Burnham and Keir Starmer have written to Theresa May this afternoon over the new concerns raised by a key joint committee about the snooper’s charter. | Labour’s Andy Burnham and Keir Starmer have written to Theresa May this afternoon over the new concerns raised by a key joint committee about the snooper’s charter. |
| It is our view that the Government must now take time to reconsider the draft Bill, taking into account the conclusions and recommendations in the three detailed reports, and return to Parliament with a significantly revised and improved Bill. | It is our view that the Government must now take time to reconsider the draft Bill, taking into account the conclusions and recommendations in the three detailed reports, and return to Parliament with a significantly revised and improved Bill. |
| A significant revision does not seem likely, though a new version will be published soon, according to the BBC’s political correspondent Eleanor Garnier. | A significant revision does not seem likely, though a new version will be published soon, according to the BBC’s political correspondent Eleanor Garnier. |
| PM's spokesman: revised Investigatory Powers Bill will be published "in coming weeks" & reiterates legislation to be in force by end 2016 | PM's spokesman: revised Investigatory Powers Bill will be published "in coming weeks" & reiterates legislation to be in force by end 2016 |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 4.16pm GMT | at 4.16pm GMT |
| 3.53pm GMT | 3.53pm GMT |
| 15:53 | 15:53 |
| Severin Carrell | Severin Carrell |
| The Guardian’s Scotland editor Severin Carroll reported earlier this week that he understood the junior contract would not be imposed north of the border. Wales has also said it will not impose the contract. | The Guardian’s Scotland editor Severin Carroll reported earlier this week that he understood the junior contract would not be imposed north of the border. Wales has also said it will not impose the contract. |
| We’ve just had that confirmed from Scottish health secretary Shona Robison, and this effectively breaks a long standing convention that NHS doctors contracts are agreed and implemented at UK level. | We’ve just had that confirmed from Scottish health secretary Shona Robison, and this effectively breaks a long standing convention that NHS doctors contracts are agreed and implemented at UK level. |
| It is extremely disappointing that the UK Government has announced the imposition of a contract that the BMA clearly feels is not right for junior doctors. | It is extremely disappointing that the UK Government has announced the imposition of a contract that the BMA clearly feels is not right for junior doctors. |
| I want to reassure junior doctors working in the NHS in Scotland that this Government will not impose any new contract on our workforce. | I want to reassure junior doctors working in the NHS in Scotland that this Government will not impose any new contract on our workforce. |
| We take a very different approach to our relations with NHS staff and are determined to continue our longstanding positive relationship - working with staff to improve and shape services for the future. | We take a very different approach to our relations with NHS staff and are determined to continue our longstanding positive relationship - working with staff to improve and shape services for the future. |
| Junior doctors are an extremely valued part of Scotland’s NHS and that is why we will continue to service the existing contract for junior doctors until such time that we feel it is right to move towards negotiations. | Junior doctors are an extremely valued part of Scotland’s NHS and that is why we will continue to service the existing contract for junior doctors until such time that we feel it is right to move towards negotiations. |
| BMA Scotland continue to be an important partner of ours and if we did decide to move towards a new contract, it would only ever be on the basis of an agreed and negotiated settlement. | BMA Scotland continue to be an important partner of ours and if we did decide to move towards a new contract, it would only ever be on the basis of an agreed and negotiated settlement. |
| We believe that working with our junior doctors and other NHS staff is ultimately in the best interests of patients. | We believe that working with our junior doctors and other NHS staff is ultimately in the best interests of patients. |
| Dr Chris Sheridan, chair of the BMA’s Scottish junior doctor committee, called the outcome in England “hugely disappointing” but welcomed the clarification by the Scottish health secretary which he called “reassuring to my colleagues here in Scotland.” | Dr Chris Sheridan, chair of the BMA’s Scottish junior doctor committee, called the outcome in England “hugely disappointing” but welcomed the clarification by the Scottish health secretary which he called “reassuring to my colleagues here in Scotland.” |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 4.04pm GMT | at 4.04pm GMT |
| 3.50pm GMT | 3.50pm GMT |
| 15:50 | 15:50 |
| Perhaps the most surprising political news of the day comes from the Green party, who announce the brother of US presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders has been appointed as their new health spokesperson. | Perhaps the most surprising political news of the day comes from the Green party, who announce the brother of US presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders has been appointed as their new health spokesperson. |
| Sanders has often been compared to Labour’s Jeremy Corbyn, an old-school socialist who caught the imagination of young, left-wing voters. | Sanders has often been compared to Labour’s Jeremy Corbyn, an old-school socialist who caught the imagination of young, left-wing voters. |
| But Larry Sanders said his brother is actually closest to the Green party in terms of his beliefs. | But Larry Sanders said his brother is actually closest to the Green party in terms of his beliefs. |
| Larry Sanders, who stood for the Greens in the May 2015 General Election, said he will campaign for further investment in the NHS as part of his new role. | Larry Sanders, who stood for the Greens in the May 2015 General Election, said he will campaign for further investment in the NHS as part of his new role. |
| “2016 should be another good year for the Green Party, but we’re not in the public’s eye as much as we should be,” he said. “We’re the only party that is consistently speaking out against NHS privatisation and we know that the public will support us on this issue.” | “2016 should be another good year for the Green Party, but we’re not in the public’s eye as much as we should be,” he said. “We’re the only party that is consistently speaking out against NHS privatisation and we know that the public will support us on this issue.” |