This article is from the source 'guardian' and was first published or seen on . It last changed over 40 days ago and won't be checked again for changes.
You can find the current article at its original source at http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/25/joris-luyendijks-project-pain-will-only-divide-europe-more
The article has changed 5 times. There is an RSS feed of changes available.
| Version 3 | Version 4 |
|---|---|
| Joris Luyendijk’s Project Pain will only divide Europe more Joris Luyendijk’s Project Pain will only divide Europe more | |
| (about 2 hours later) | |
| I understand the annoyance of Joris Luyendijk with the UK (After Brexit, a game plan for the EU: unleash Project Pain, 25 July), but the logic of any “Project Pain” is counterproductive to the cause we both support. Our mutual cause is a Europe with a successful economy, cooperation between nations, the furtherance of citizens’ rights and a successful EU. If Project Pain pushed a harder Brexit position, for example in forcing the UK out without a trade deal, this would affect European companies, UK trading, EU citizens in the UK, and the amount the UK pays to Europe. Yes, it would hit the UK more than Europe, but this would damage the European cause even further. | I understand the annoyance of Joris Luyendijk with the UK (After Brexit, a game plan for the EU: unleash Project Pain, 25 July), but the logic of any “Project Pain” is counterproductive to the cause we both support. Our mutual cause is a Europe with a successful economy, cooperation between nations, the furtherance of citizens’ rights and a successful EU. If Project Pain pushed a harder Brexit position, for example in forcing the UK out without a trade deal, this would affect European companies, UK trading, EU citizens in the UK, and the amount the UK pays to Europe. Yes, it would hit the UK more than Europe, but this would damage the European cause even further. |
| The European right want to cut as many national ties with the EU as possible, and their position is not influenced by the severity of the pain inflicted. The hard right needs to be split from those who voted as a national protest or those who didn’t sufficiently see the benefits of EU. If the EU moves to inflict a clearly painful version of “hard Brexit”, the right can say that the EU is a bully – wrong for the UK and other EU members, with neither the UK nor the EU being perceived in a positive light by wavering voters. Contagion is best mitigated through stressing the benefits of membership and reaching a Brexit-light outcome (if we are unable to remain) that will be welcomed by pro-Europeans and condemned as a sellout by the hard right across Europe. | The European right want to cut as many national ties with the EU as possible, and their position is not influenced by the severity of the pain inflicted. The hard right needs to be split from those who voted as a national protest or those who didn’t sufficiently see the benefits of EU. If the EU moves to inflict a clearly painful version of “hard Brexit”, the right can say that the EU is a bully – wrong for the UK and other EU members, with neither the UK nor the EU being perceived in a positive light by wavering voters. Contagion is best mitigated through stressing the benefits of membership and reaching a Brexit-light outcome (if we are unable to remain) that will be welcomed by pro-Europeans and condemned as a sellout by the hard right across Europe. |
| Regardless of the final outcome, we are already feeling the pain of the leave vote, in terms of the hit on professional services, science, education and cultural industries, as well as in our ability to argue for UK interests at a European and global level. I would appeal to our European colleagues not to make a bad decision worse, let’s work together to further European cooperation.Richard ElliottLondon | Regardless of the final outcome, we are already feeling the pain of the leave vote, in terms of the hit on professional services, science, education and cultural industries, as well as in our ability to argue for UK interests at a European and global level. I would appeal to our European colleagues not to make a bad decision worse, let’s work together to further European cooperation.Richard ElliottLondon |
| • Joris Luyendijk is Dutch. No British person would dream of writing an article that calls for the Netherlands to be punished for exercising its democratic right to leave an international association. | • Joris Luyendijk is Dutch. No British person would dream of writing an article that calls for the Netherlands to be punished for exercising its democratic right to leave an international association. |
| I voted for Brexit principally because the EU is undemocratic. The purpose of democracy is not to foster good government (although it tends to) or to keep everyone happy. It is a process for changing laws and government without violence. Its failure can be seen in Ukraine and Turkey at the present time. | I voted for Brexit principally because the EU is undemocratic. The purpose of democracy is not to foster good government (although it tends to) or to keep everyone happy. It is a process for changing laws and government without violence. Its failure can be seen in Ukraine and Turkey at the present time. |
| Mr Luyendijk’s proposal is not only undemocratic. Its spirit is comparable to helping the Iraqis by invading, bombing and shooting them. It confirms that the UK is incompatible culturally with continental Europe. | Mr Luyendijk’s proposal is not only undemocratic. Its spirit is comparable to helping the Iraqis by invading, bombing and shooting them. It confirms that the UK is incompatible culturally with continental Europe. |
| Nor is it a matter of “good deals” or pain to undo Brexit. This is another misunderstanding. This article illustrates perfectly why we were right to leave the EU.Christopher KingPurley, Surrey | Nor is it a matter of “good deals” or pain to undo Brexit. This is another misunderstanding. This article illustrates perfectly why we were right to leave the EU.Christopher KingPurley, Surrey |
| • Joris Luyendijk asserts that a “reasonable deal for the UK [with the EU]” is “a prospect far more threatening than Brexit”. Such an argument shows a total ignorance of the livelihoods of ordinary people. | • Joris Luyendijk asserts that a “reasonable deal for the UK [with the EU]” is “a prospect far more threatening than Brexit”. Such an argument shows a total ignorance of the livelihoods of ordinary people. |
| Although it might send a message to the European political elites if the EU tries (as Mr Luyendijk recommends) “to inflict maximum political and economic damage” on the UK, such a deal limiting freedom of movement and free trade would harm average people the most. Friends of mine have small businesses that rely on exports to EU countries, and others have only been able to find suitable work by taking advantage of freedom of movement. Hundreds of thousands of jobs on both sides of the Channel rely on the agreement between the EU and the UK, and the increased economic opportunity provided by the lack of barriers on trade and movement. | Although it might send a message to the European political elites if the EU tries (as Mr Luyendijk recommends) “to inflict maximum political and economic damage” on the UK, such a deal limiting freedom of movement and free trade would harm average people the most. Friends of mine have small businesses that rely on exports to EU countries, and others have only been able to find suitable work by taking advantage of freedom of movement. Hundreds of thousands of jobs on both sides of the Channel rely on the agreement between the EU and the UK, and the increased economic opportunity provided by the lack of barriers on trade and movement. |
| Although Mr Luyendijk states aims of “reinventing British democracy” and sending a message to anti-EU parties across Europe, it is inevitably those at the bottom who would, unjustly, be hurt most by such a harsh agreement between the EU and the UK.Rob HindhaughLondon | Although Mr Luyendijk states aims of “reinventing British democracy” and sending a message to anti-EU parties across Europe, it is inevitably those at the bottom who would, unjustly, be hurt most by such a harsh agreement between the EU and the UK.Rob HindhaughLondon |
| • It took me some time to realise that Joris Luyendijk’s polemic about Brexit was not a send-up, as it is so extreme in tone and proposition. | • It took me some time to realise that Joris Luyendijk’s polemic about Brexit was not a send-up, as it is so extreme in tone and proposition. |
| It also wholly unrealistic, as the British do not respond well to threats, as should already be well understood, and such a course of action would harden our resolve and be pyrrhic in the extreme. | It also wholly unrealistic, as the British do not respond well to threats, as should already be well understood, and such a course of action would harden our resolve and be pyrrhic in the extreme. |
| The British people were given the opportunity to vote and voted to leave the EU; whatever the reasons for that decision, it was the product of a democratic process.Tim ElsterAshbourne, Derbyshire | The British people were given the opportunity to vote and voted to leave the EU; whatever the reasons for that decision, it was the product of a democratic process.Tim ElsterAshbourne, Derbyshire |
| • I deeply regret the vote to leave – but it was a democratic vote, and the idea that the UK should be subject to a form of collective punishment, including active subversion of its economy, as a warning to any other country daring to think to do the same is deeply abhorrent. Nick StarlingLondon | • I deeply regret the vote to leave – but it was a democratic vote, and the idea that the UK should be subject to a form of collective punishment, including active subversion of its economy, as a warning to any other country daring to think to do the same is deeply abhorrent. Nick StarlingLondon |
| • Join the debate – email guardian.letters@theguardian.com | • Join the debate – email guardian.letters@theguardian.com |