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| Version 4 | Version 5 |
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| Southern rail strike begins after court rejects appeal – live updates | Southern rail strike begins after court rejects appeal – live updates |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| 11.01am GMT | |
| 11:01 | |
| Rachel Obordo | |
| We’ve been hearing from commuters who have been forced to find alternative ways of getting into work, writes Rachel Obordo. Richard from Tattenham Corner had to spend extra time and money to get into central London. | |
| Additional bus, tube and expense | |
| Usually board a train into London Bridge from my home station of Tattenham Corner. This morning I got a bus to Epsom main and then a (very busy) train to London Waterloo and tube to London Bridge. I have a monthly zones 1-6 travelcard but Epsom mainline station is outside of Zone 6 therefore I have to pay an additional fare. Daily journeys are normal painful enough. | |
| Sent via Guardian Witness | |
| By Richard Pain | |
| 13 December 2016, 10:20 | |
| Another GuardianWitness contributor shares a picture of an overcrowded train. | |
| Overcrowding on London transport | |
| Over the past two weeks it is exceptional how many people have been packed onto the trains as well as the buses in London. On many occasions I have spent the morning on the way to work far too close to many of the other commuters who are desperate to get to work and not be late in order to keep their job. This brings me into the southern railway strike which is happening in London today. Many people are unhappy with their jobs however most of us still get up in the morning and make our way to work in order to make a living and ensure that we have food to put on the table for our families and ourselves. Multitudes of people are in desperate need of a job and I am sure that if the people on the trains are unhappy then they can leave their jobs and someone else will take their place. I am a strong believer that if you are unhappy you need to make a change, I do however believe that we should appreciate what we have and been thoughtful to others in the world as well who are also trying to make a living. London transport needs to run smoother, but it is with the help of everyone as a team which can make this happen. The drivers going against the people whose money goes into the system and pays their wages is not the way to go about it. As seen in the photo above people are even standing on the top deck? Therefore everyone's safety has also been compromised due to this strike. Change needs to happen but we needn't to work together in order to make it successful for us all. It is as if people in this world have forgotten how to talk to each other. | |
| Sent via Guardian Witness | |
| By Piinkbezzi | |
| 13 December 2016, 9:55 | |
| Despite the crush, reader GydaGwen, still supports the strikes | |
| Inconvenienced but supportive | |
| I managed to get a very busy Thameslink to work this morning but others weren't so lucky. I support the strikes because I know the government's stance is political. I don't trust anything Grayling says. Southern are awful and the franchise should be given to TfL. | |
| Sent via Guardian Witness | |
| By GydaGwen | |
| 13 December 2016, 9:57 | |
| 10.56am GMT | |
| 10:56 | |
| Damien Gayle | |
| The RMT’s Steve Hedley insists the strike is about removing the “safety critical” role of guards on trains. | |
| Speaking to Damien Gayle at London Bridge he said hoped the government would allow Govia, which operates the Southern Rail franchise, to negotiate in good faith. “As you can see there is a total shutdown today of the entire network,” he said. | |
| #southernstrike @RMTunion's Steve Hedley explains why @ASLEFunion drivers are on strike pic.twitter.com/dxqbiY3QHh | |
| 10.46am GMT | |
| 10:46 | |
| The strike continues to divide politicians on party lines. Labour MP Rob Flello reacted with anger, after Grayling suggeseted that the government is considering changing union law to ban strikes on the rail network. | |
| Don't even think about banning strikes Grayling. It's a democracy do your job instead & facilitate talks #southernstrike | |
| Former Tory MP, and former children’s minister Tim Loughton pointed out Labour’s financial ties to the unions involved in the dispute. | |
| ASLEF gave Labour £185,000 & RMT donated £4125 to Islington North Labour Party-in unconnected news Labour refusing to condemn rail strike | |
| The SNP’s Gavin Newlands calls for more geographical perspective. | |
| Question for those outside of London. Do u think if this strike had been north of Watford this would have led news? Me neither #southernrail pic.twitter.com/YZlnDVCfvj | |
| Updated | |
| at 10.48am GMT | |
| 10.40am GMT | |
| 10:40 | |
| Chris Grayling has dismissed Sadiq Khan’s call to switch control of Southern to Transport for London as “simply nonsense”. | |
| Speaking to LBC he said: | |
| “What the Mayor is doing is promising one thing to people inside London and another thing to people outside. | |
| “The Mayor’s just said we’ll provide faster more frequent services. Well the reality is if you get a suburban train in the morning, you know that these these tracks are jammed full. The challenge is getting any space for any more trains. He’s also promised people outside London that he won’t actually introduce more trains because of the fears outside London that actually there might be fewer services from the coast for example. So I don’t buy this. | |
| “He’s been Mayor for four and a half months, he’s got some significant problems with Transport for London having big financial difficulties, the Piccadilly Line is in a state of chaos, he’s running out of money for projects already in the pipeline and he’s making grand promises about things like bridges over the Thames he hasn’t got the money to build. | |
| “So I’m afraid people should take what the Mayyor says with a pinch of salt. | |
| “Let’s concentrate this week on trying to get a resolution to the Southern rail dispute, which is all about services in Cambridge to Brighton not services that are just within London.” | |
| Updated | |
| at 10.55am GMT | |
| 10.27am GMT | 10.27am GMT |
| 10:27 | 10:27 |
| Damien Gayle | Damien Gayle |
| Damien Gayle has been talking to pickets outside London Bridge station. | Damien Gayle has been talking to pickets outside London Bridge station. |
| One driver, who preferred not to be named, said the issue they werestriking over was safety. “If you’ve got a 12 carriage train coming upfrom Brighton, it could have a thousand people onboard.”One driver without a guard was not able to ensure the safety of somany passengers, he added. | One driver, who preferred not to be named, said the issue they werestriking over was safety. “If you’ve got a 12 carriage train coming upfrom Brighton, it could have a thousand people onboard.”One driver without a guard was not able to ensure the safety of somany passengers, he added. |
| 10.22am GMT | 10.22am GMT |
| 10:22 | 10:22 |
| The Press Association has stories of commuter woe: | The Press Association has stories of commuter woe: |
| A man who will miss telling his two young children a bedtime story because of the Southern strike is just one of the thousands of angry commuters to vent their frustrations. | A man who will miss telling his two young children a bedtime story because of the Southern strike is just one of the thousands of angry commuters to vent their frustrations. |
| Jim Boyden, a management consultant, from Shoreham, West Sussex, said he will be forced to stay in a London hotel until Thursday because of the lack of trains between his home and Victoria. | Jim Boyden, a management consultant, from Shoreham, West Sussex, said he will be forced to stay in a London hotel until Thursday because of the lack of trains between his home and Victoria. |
| The 38-year-old shared a photo of his one-year-old son Zac and wrote an emotional tweet to Southern: “Because of your strike, I am unable to travel home until Thursday and read him and his sister a story. Because of your strike, we will not discover what animal is hiding in his favourite book tonight, or tomorrow night. | The 38-year-old shared a photo of his one-year-old son Zac and wrote an emotional tweet to Southern: “Because of your strike, I am unable to travel home until Thursday and read him and his sister a story. Because of your strike, we will not discover what animal is hiding in his favourite book tonight, or tomorrow night. |
| “Because of your strike, he will be unable to take me by the hand and show me his favourite toy, which is ironically, a choo choo train. | “Because of your strike, he will be unable to take me by the hand and show me his favourite toy, which is ironically, a choo choo train. |
| “Because of your strike, I will miss his smile. | “Because of your strike, I will miss his smile. |
| “You can refund me my Season Ticket. You can refund me my hotel. I can even make up time at work, but how – how – are you going to give me back the things money can’t buy? “For God’s sake, sort it out.” | “You can refund me my Season Ticket. You can refund me my hotel. I can even make up time at work, but how – how – are you going to give me back the things money can’t buy? “For God’s sake, sort it out.” |
| Another parent who took to the social media site to complain was a mother whose six-year-old daughter was left in tears after a school trip to the British Museum was called off at the last minute due to the train chaos - which included problems on TfL’s Victoria Underground line. | Another parent who took to the social media site to complain was a mother whose six-year-old daughter was left in tears after a school trip to the British Museum was called off at the last minute due to the train chaos - which included problems on TfL’s Victoria Underground line. |
| Monica Corduff-Gonzalez, 44, from Forest Hill, south-east London, said: “With the anticipated extra pressure on the Overground created by there being no Southern service, and severe delays at Highbury and Islington, the school decided to postpone the trip to the new year. | Monica Corduff-Gonzalez, 44, from Forest Hill, south-east London, said: “With the anticipated extra pressure on the Overground created by there being no Southern service, and severe delays at Highbury and Islington, the school decided to postpone the trip to the new year. |
| “I was going to be going on the trip with my daughter and my husband was taking the day off work to look after my toddler. My daughter was super excited about the trip and having her mum with her, and there was flood of tears this morning at finding out the trip was cancelled for today.” | “I was going to be going on the trip with my daughter and my husband was taking the day off work to look after my toddler. My daughter was super excited about the trip and having her mum with her, and there was flood of tears this morning at finding out the trip was cancelled for today.” |
| One commuter who usually uses Southern Rail to get from Sydenham in south-east London to King’s Cross left the house more than two hours early to avoid overcrowding on the alternative Overground service. | One commuter who usually uses Southern Rail to get from Sydenham in south-east London to King’s Cross left the house more than two hours early to avoid overcrowding on the alternative Overground service. |
| Carmen Butterworth left at 5.45am instead of 8am to avoid being late for work. | Carmen Butterworth left at 5.45am instead of 8am to avoid being late for work. |
| Butterworth, 33, a personal assistant, told the Press Association: “I knew that everyone would be forced to use the already overcrowded Overground and it would probably be a struggle to even board and I can’t be late to work. | Butterworth, 33, a personal assistant, told the Press Association: “I knew that everyone would be forced to use the already overcrowded Overground and it would probably be a struggle to even board and I can’t be late to work. |
| “The blame doesn’t just fall with Southern. However I do not think much of how they have handled the strike – telling half a million people not to attempt to travel on a work day isn’t practical.” | “The blame doesn’t just fall with Southern. However I do not think much of how they have handled the strike – telling half a million people not to attempt to travel on a work day isn’t practical.” |
| People’s tweets caused #southernstrike and #southernrail to trend on Twitter. | People’s tweets caused #southernstrike and #southernrail to trend on Twitter. |
| Natasha Gourlay-Harris took to Twitter to call on Southern to refund her pre-paid 30 Christmas work lunch, which she feared she would miss because of the strike. | Natasha Gourlay-Harris took to Twitter to call on Southern to refund her pre-paid 30 Christmas work lunch, which she feared she would miss because of the strike. |
| Gourlay-Harris, 45, travels from Cheam, near Sutton, to London Victoria via Hackbridge and was stuck on a bus “in appalling traffic” for half an hour before finding the main entrance to Sutton station had been closed - with commuters being funnelled through a smaller second entrance. | Gourlay-Harris, 45, travels from Cheam, near Sutton, to London Victoria via Hackbridge and was stuck on a bus “in appalling traffic” for half an hour before finding the main entrance to Sutton station had been closed - with commuters being funnelled through a smaller second entrance. |
| The personal assistant said: “When will the Government step in?! I pay over 2,000 a year for a really awful service and then I read the company that owns Southern are taking in 90+ million in profits? It’s criminal. And criminal that these profits are not going back into the system that makes all this money.” | The personal assistant said: “When will the Government step in?! I pay over 2,000 a year for a really awful service and then I read the company that owns Southern are taking in 90+ million in profits? It’s criminal. And criminal that these profits are not going back into the system that makes all this money.” |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.27am GMT | at 10.27am GMT |
| 10.01am GMT | 10.01am GMT |
| 10:01 | 10:01 |
| Some car drivers have been tooting support for striking train drivers at the Selhurst depot picket in south London, PA’s Jemma Crew reports. | Some car drivers have been tooting support for striking train drivers at the Selhurst depot picket in south London, PA’s Jemma Crew reports. |
| Passing cars hoot in support of drivers on the #southernstrike picket line outside Selhurst depot pic.twitter.com/X23fOvG5jv | Passing cars hoot in support of drivers on the #southernstrike picket line outside Selhurst depot pic.twitter.com/X23fOvG5jv |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.13am GMT | at 10.13am GMT |
| 9.57am GMT | 9.57am GMT |
| 09:57 | 09:57 |
| The transport secretary, Chris Grayling, has rejected London mayor Sadiq Khan’s proposal to put Transport for London in charge of the suburban rail services currently run by Southern and other operators. | |
| In a letter to MPs, Grayling said: “Transport for London has no experience of running a mainline railway like this.” | In a letter to MPs, Grayling said: “Transport for London has no experience of running a mainline railway like this.” |
| He also claimed the rail unions were being unreasonable. The letter says: “I wish we were dealing with reasonable people on the union side. For all the shortcomings of the train operator – and there have been many – and the failures of the infrastructure – also many – it is difficult to resolve any of the other problems on this network while the union leadership seem hell bent on fermenting this dispute.” | He also claimed the rail unions were being unreasonable. The letter says: “I wish we were dealing with reasonable people on the union side. For all the shortcomings of the train operator – and there have been many – and the failures of the infrastructure – also many – it is difficult to resolve any of the other problems on this network while the union leadership seem hell bent on fermenting this dispute.” |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.51am GMT | |
| 9.43am GMT | 9.43am GMT |
| 09:43 | 09:43 |
| Damien Gayle | Damien Gayle |
| At London Bridge station, a key Southern rail terminus, every platform was marked with a large red X, writes Damien Gayle. | At London Bridge station, a key Southern rail terminus, every platform was marked with a large red X, writes Damien Gayle. |
| A few passengers were waiting, scratching their heads.Benan Yolcu, 21, a law and criminology student at Brighton University, said the strike had affected her “horribly”. | A few passengers were waiting, scratching their heads.Benan Yolcu, 21, a law and criminology student at Brighton University, said the strike had affected her “horribly”. |
| “I have an exam today and I don’t think I’m going to make it on time.” | “I have an exam today and I don’t think I’m going to make it on time.” |
| She said she knew a strike was coming, but added: “I thought it was not going to be today, and when I checked online [on a rail timetable app] it said that everything was running normally.” | She said she knew a strike was coming, but added: “I thought it was not going to be today, and when I checked online [on a rail timetable app] it said that everything was running normally.” |
| She held up her phone to prove her point. | She held up her phone to prove her point. |
| Yolcu said she had no idea why the train drivers had gone on strike. Still, she had some sympathy for them. | Yolcu said she had no idea why the train drivers had gone on strike. Still, she had some sympathy for them. |
| “I understand that they might have their reasons,” she said. “However, [Brighton trains] every hour? Come on. People have things to do. I understand people have their situations, but other people have jobs.” | “I understand that they might have their reasons,” she said. “However, [Brighton trains] every hour? Come on. People have things to do. I understand people have their situations, but other people have jobs.” |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.18am GMT | at 10.18am GMT |
| 9.36am GMT | 9.36am GMT |
| 09:36 | 09:36 |
| Departure boards at London Victoria and London Bridge make grim reading. | Departure boards at London Victoria and London Bridge make grim reading. |
| Damien Gayle at London Bridge says there are very angry passengers on the concourse. His snap of the departure board explains why. | Damien Gayle at London Bridge says there are very angry passengers on the concourse. His snap of the departure board explains why. |
| More than half the departure boards at Victoria this morning displaying no journey information #southernstrike pic.twitter.com/pNj7ui1cyV | More than half the departure boards at Victoria this morning displaying no journey information #southernstrike pic.twitter.com/pNj7ui1cyV |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.45am GMT | at 9.45am GMT |
| 9.25am GMT | 9.25am GMT |
| 09:25 | 09:25 |
| Caroline Bannock | Caroline Bannock |
| If you’ve been affected by the strike we’d like to hear from you. Are you using alternative means to get into work or are you staying at home? If you won’t be making it into the office, what are you doing instead? You can share your experiences, photos and videos with us by clicking on the blue ‘Contribute’ button on the blog. | If you’ve been affected by the strike we’d like to hear from you. Are you using alternative means to get into work or are you staying at home? If you won’t be making it into the office, what are you doing instead? You can share your experiences, photos and videos with us by clicking on the blue ‘Contribute’ button on the blog. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.45am GMT | at 9.45am GMT |
| 9.21am GMT | 9.21am GMT |
| 09:21 | 09:21 |
| Opposition politicians continue to blame the government for the strike. | Opposition politicians continue to blame the government for the strike. |
| The Green party joint leader, Caroline Lucas, urged ministers to do more to resolve the dispute. | The Green party joint leader, Caroline Lucas, urged ministers to do more to resolve the dispute. |
| Profound sympathy with other #Southernfail passengers battling rail system today. Govt should be actively resolving it not washing hands | Profound sympathy with other #Southernfail passengers battling rail system today. Govt should be actively resolving it not washing hands |
| Labour’s former shadow transport secretary Michael Dugher says the strike highlights systemic problems with the rail network. | Labour’s former shadow transport secretary Michael Dugher says the strike highlights systemic problems with the rail network. |
| Southern Rail shows a railway system that, as Labour has highlighted for years, doesn't work for passengers. Zero accountability or control | Southern Rail shows a railway system that, as Labour has highlighted for years, doesn't work for passengers. Zero accountability or control |
| Shadow Welsh secretary, Jo Stevens, is also backing the strike. | Shadow Welsh secretary, Jo Stevens, is also backing the strike. |
| Judges rule @ASLEFunion legitimately taking industrial action. Legal burden on unions already onerous. Tories now want to ban rail strikes | Judges rule @ASLEFunion legitimately taking industrial action. Legal burden on unions already onerous. Tories now want to ban rail strikes |
| But the Labour MP Simon Danczuk, who had the party whip withdrawn after a sexting scandal, is sceptical about the strike. | But the Labour MP Simon Danczuk, who had the party whip withdrawn after a sexting scandal, is sceptical about the strike. |
| This @BBCr4today interview isn't going well for the train union guy - sounds like he wants the strike simply to be vindictive #justsaying | This @BBCr4today interview isn't going well for the train union guy - sounds like he wants the strike simply to be vindictive #justsaying |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.46am GMT | at 9.46am GMT |
| 9.01am GMT | 9.01am GMT |
| 09:01 | 09:01 |
| The transport secretary, Chris Grayling, has been giving a series of broadcast interviews expressing his view that the strike is “futile”. | The transport secretary, Chris Grayling, has been giving a series of broadcast interviews expressing his view that the strike is “futile”. |
| His department has also posted a defiant video address in which Grayling says: “We are not prepared to end the modernisation of the railways.” | His department has also posted a defiant video address in which Grayling says: “We are not prepared to end the modernisation of the railways.” |
| He said he didn’t understand why the unions were so resistant to modern technology. | He said he didn’t understand why the unions were so resistant to modern technology. |
| Unions strike action unnecessary. No jobs being lost and no pay being cut - unions disputing who presses button to close train doors. pic.twitter.com/dpJE3nYg91 | Unions strike action unnecessary. No jobs being lost and no pay being cut - unions disputing who presses button to close train doors. pic.twitter.com/dpJE3nYg91 |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.49am GMT | at 9.49am GMT |
| 8.55am GMT | 8.55am GMT |
| 08:55 | 08:55 |
| Julian Glover, the former special adviser at the Department for Transport, insists the strike is about union pride and their control of the railways rather than safety as the unions claim. | Julian Glover, the former special adviser at the Department for Transport, insists the strike is about union pride and their control of the railways rather than safety as the unions claim. |
| Miserable rail strike isn't about 1. safety - driver control's been used since BR and it's fine or 2. jobs, protected. Or pay. | Miserable rail strike isn't about 1. safety - driver control's been used since BR and it's fine or 2. jobs, protected. Or pay. |
| Strike IS about 1. union control of rail - can trains run w/out RMT permission 2. pride. Southern's got people's backs up. | Strike IS about 1. union control of rail - can trains run w/out RMT permission 2. pride. Southern's got people's backs up. |
| Unions should meet govt. without conditions and talk. Old working practices + higher costs + higher fares = less investment, worse trains | Unions should meet govt. without conditions and talk. Old working practices + higher costs + higher fares = less investment, worse trains |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.59am GMT | at 9.59am GMT |
| 8.46am GMT | 8.46am GMT |
| 08:46 | 08:46 |
| Damien Gayle | Damien Gayle |
| Commuters at Balham station are being forced to take taxis to work, writes Damien Gayle. | Commuters at Balham station are being forced to take taxis to work, writes Damien Gayle. |
| Andrea Dunn, 24, and Gemma, who declined to give her surname, 32, werewaiting outside Balham station to share an Uber taxi. “We’re totalstrangers waiting to share an Uber now,” Gemma said.Dunn, who works at Sky, said she had no idea what thestrike action was about. But Gemma, who said she would miss a clientmeeting as a result of the strike, had stronger opinions. “I’m blamingthe RMT,” she said. “I think they are too aggressive, too frequent.”Asked what she knew about the reasons for the strike, Gemma said:“Train guards and locking doors, I think. Not having enough trainguards; they want to take train guards away so there’s no one to lockdoors in person.”Gemma’s assessment of the strike was even shared by oneSouthern rail worker directing passengers to alternative routes.“These drivers are never happy, but they earn £55k,” the worker said.“They are making these problems up. I saw my manager … normally theRMT and him, they should be different things, right? But they go outfor drinks together. It’s all planned, we know that.“They are going to have a very nice Christmas.” | Andrea Dunn, 24, and Gemma, who declined to give her surname, 32, werewaiting outside Balham station to share an Uber taxi. “We’re totalstrangers waiting to share an Uber now,” Gemma said.Dunn, who works at Sky, said she had no idea what thestrike action was about. But Gemma, who said she would miss a clientmeeting as a result of the strike, had stronger opinions. “I’m blamingthe RMT,” she said. “I think they are too aggressive, too frequent.”Asked what she knew about the reasons for the strike, Gemma said:“Train guards and locking doors, I think. Not having enough trainguards; they want to take train guards away so there’s no one to lockdoors in person.”Gemma’s assessment of the strike was even shared by oneSouthern rail worker directing passengers to alternative routes.“These drivers are never happy, but they earn £55k,” the worker said.“They are making these problems up. I saw my manager … normally theRMT and him, they should be different things, right? But they go outfor drinks together. It’s all planned, we know that.“They are going to have a very nice Christmas.” |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.01am GMT | at 10.01am GMT |