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Western spies no better than Russians, say espionage experts Western spies no better than Russians, say espionage experts
(35 minutes later)
Western spy services are no better than the bungling Russians at Salisbury, and all agencies repeatedly fail to learn the lessons of the past, a panel of espionage experts has said.Western spy services are no better than the bungling Russians at Salisbury, and all agencies repeatedly fail to learn the lessons of the past, a panel of espionage experts has said.
The former MI5 officer Annie Machon said the “hysteria” over Russia was disingenuous when British and American intelligence services had been guilty of similarly bad behaviour.The former MI5 officer Annie Machon said the “hysteria” over Russia was disingenuous when British and American intelligence services had been guilty of similarly bad behaviour.
“The Snowden disclosures were only five years ago showing, indeed, our intelligence services were doing the same things as the rest of the world and for us to clutch our pearls and say: ‘Oh my God the Russians are bad and we’re good’ is I think slightly disingenuous,” Machon said on Monday. “The Snowden disclosures were only five years ago showing, indeed, our intelligence services were doing the same things as the rest of the world and for us to clutch our pearls and say: ‘Oh my God, the Russians are bad and we’re good’ is I think slightly disingenuous,” Machon said on Monday.
Machon, the former partner of MI6 whistleblower David Shayler, said western spy agencies were frequently guilty of allowing things to “spiral out of control”. Machon, the former partner of the MI6 whistleblower David Shayler, said western spy agencies were frequently guilty of allowing things to “spiral out of control”.
She said while the Russians had been caught with their “pants down”, “we have situations as well within international intelligence where it’s perhaps not quite as rosy”.She said while the Russians had been caught with their “pants down”, “we have situations as well within international intelligence where it’s perhaps not quite as rosy”.
Machon was speaking at a packed session featuring espionage experts debating “The Spying Game” at the Cheltenham literature festival.Machon was speaking at a packed session featuring espionage experts debating “The Spying Game” at the Cheltenham literature festival.
The intelligence historian Christopher Andrew, writer of the authorised history of MI5, said the Salisbury events were “nothing new”. KGB assassination attempts during the cold war 50 years ago were “so incompetent that they called them off for over a decade”, he said.The intelligence historian Christopher Andrew, writer of the authorised history of MI5, said the Salisbury events were “nothing new”. KGB assassination attempts during the cold war 50 years ago were “so incompetent that they called them off for over a decade”, he said.
Andrew said intelligence, more than any other profession, repeatedly failed to learn from its mistakes and the reason was obvious: the operations were always secret.Andrew said intelligence, more than any other profession, repeatedly failed to learn from its mistakes and the reason was obvious: the operations were always secret.
He said he used to have friends and Cambridge colleagues who worked at Bletchley Park. “None of them, none of them knew that what they had been doing in the second world war, breaking Hitler’s codes, was much what their colleagues had been doing at the beginning of the 19th century, breaking codes with equal success. He said he used to have friends and Cambridge colleagues who worked at Bletchley Park. “None of them, none of them knew that what they had been doing in the second world war, breaking Hitler’s codes, was much what their colleagues had been doing at the beginning of the 19th century, breaking codes with equal success. “No profession is as ignorant of its history as the profession of intelligence.”
“No profession is as ignorant of its history as the profession of intelligence.”
He pointed to the first world war prime minister, Herbert Henry Asquith, and the US president Woodrow Wilson, two of the most highly educated people to get their jobs.He pointed to the first world war prime minister, Herbert Henry Asquith, and the US president Woodrow Wilson, two of the most highly educated people to get their jobs.
Neither knew anything about intelligence, Andrew said, adding that if George Washington had used intelligence in the same way Wilson did the American success in the war of independence would have taken much longer.Neither knew anything about intelligence, Andrew said, adding that if George Washington had used intelligence in the same way Wilson did the American success in the war of independence would have taken much longer.
The panel said it was one reason torture was used over the centuries.The panel said it was one reason torture was used over the centuries.
Andrew said of waterboarding: “The absurd attempt by some people, whether the CIA or George W [Bush], to claim that it wasn’t torture. Well the Spanish Inquisition, which invented it, could have told them it was torture, and it didn’t work. Intelligence is more than any other profession, one in which it is possible to go backwards.”Andrew said of waterboarding: “The absurd attempt by some people, whether the CIA or George W [Bush], to claim that it wasn’t torture. Well the Spanish Inquisition, which invented it, could have told them it was torture, and it didn’t work. Intelligence is more than any other profession, one in which it is possible to go backwards.”
Machon said most people who went into the intelligence services did so for the right reasons – they wanted to make things better. But there remained an oligarchical structure where dissent was dismissed, and an absence of channels for people to raise ethical concerns, she said.Machon said most people who went into the intelligence services did so for the right reasons – they wanted to make things better. But there remained an oligarchical structure where dissent was dismissed, and an absence of channels for people to raise ethical concerns, she said.
Cheltenham literature festivalCheltenham literature festival
MI5MI5
RussiaRussia
EspionageEspionage
UK security and counter-terrorismUK security and counter-terrorism
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