''I guess that's revealing': David Rubenstein on Trump and the weight of history' diff viewer (0/1)

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'I guess that's revealing': David Rubenstein on Trump and the weight of history	'I guess that's revealing': David Rubenstein on Trump and the weight of history
2019-11-02 06:26:14 UTC	2019-11-02 07:36:17 UTC (about 1 hour later)
At the Economic Club of Washington DC, one day in July this year, David Rubenstein asked Mike Pompeo a question. When working with Donald Trump, the billionaire philanthropist-cum-interviewer asked the secretary of state, what is the process by which decisions are made?	At the Economic Club of Washington DC, one day in July this year, David Rubenstein asked Mike Pompeo a question. When working with Donald Trump, the billionaire philanthropist-cum-interviewer asked the secretary of state, what is the process by which decisions are made?
~~Democrats~~ ~~have~~ ~~fallen~~ ~~behind~~ ~~Trump~~ in ~~digital~~ ~~campaigning,~~ ~~Obama~~ ~~aide~~ ~~warns~~	Experts on Trump's conduct: 'Plainly an abuse of power, plainly impeachable'
Pompeo said there was “a very robust National Security Council process”, and that when meeting the president, he always brought “a one-page summary, at the very least, that says, ‘Here’s the outline of what it is that I think are the priorities now.’”	Pompeo said there was “a very robust National Security Council process”, and that when meeting the president, he always brought “a one-page summary, at the very least, that says, ‘Here’s the outline of what it is that I think are the priorities now.’”
And then he said something else: Trump is “very focused on where the money is, and how we use economic leverage to achieve our diplomatic ends”.	And then he said something else: Trump is “very focused on where the money is, and how we use economic leverage to achieve our diplomatic ends”.
The interview took place on 29 July 2019. That was four days after Pompeo and other senior aides sat in on a call between Trump and Vlodymyr Zelenskiy, the new president of Ukraine.	The interview took place on 29 July 2019. That was four days after Pompeo and other senior aides sat in on a call between Trump and Vlodymyr Zelenskiy, the new president of Ukraine.
Whether Trump asked Zelenskiy to carry out investigations of his political rivals in return for the release of nearly $400m in military aid, and whether that would constitute a serious abuse of power, is now the key issue in the impeachment inquiry.	Whether Trump asked Zelenskiy to carry out investigations of his political rivals in return for the release of nearly $400m in military aid, and whether that would constitute a serious abuse of power, is now the key issue in the impeachment inquiry.
On a rainy Halloween in New York City, in a 33rd-floor conference room at the Carlyle Group, the investment giant Rubenstein co-founded, the interviewer sits down to be interviewed.	On a rainy Halloween in New York City, in a 33rd-floor conference room at the Carlyle Group, the investment giant Rubenstein co-founded, the interviewer sits down to be interviewed.
At the same time, in Washington, on Capitol Hill, House Democrats are passing a vote to formalise the impeachment process.	At the same time, in Washington, on Capitol Hill, House Democrats are passing a vote to formalise the impeachment process.
I read him Pompeo’s quote.	I read him Pompeo’s quote.
“I hadn’t gone back and read that transcript since I did the interview,” Rubenstein says, “and you just pointed out something I hadn’t focused on.	“I hadn’t gone back and read that transcript since I did the interview,” Rubenstein says, “and you just pointed out something I hadn’t focused on.
“I guess that’s revealing in the way it’s put.”	“I guess that’s revealing in the way it’s put.”
Rubenstein is not a journalist but he spends a great deal of time interviewing politicians and leaders. He is not a historian, but he spends a great deal of time interviewing historians. Which is why we’re here.	Rubenstein is not a journalist but he spends a great deal of time interviewing politicians and leaders. He is not a historian, but he spends a great deal of time interviewing historians. Which is why we’re here.
Rubenstein still chairs the Carlyle Group and according to Forbes is worth $3bn and change. But for some time he has been practising what he calls “patriotic philanthropy”.	Rubenstein still chairs the Carlyle Group and according to Forbes is worth $3bn and change. But for some time he has been practising what he calls “patriotic philanthropy”.
Most visibly, that means buying historic documents (Magna Carta, the Declaration of Independence, the Emancipation Proclamation) and restoring important sites (the Washington Monument, Monticello, the Lincoln Memorial). Two days before we meet, he announces $10m for the Jefferson Memorial in Washington.	Most visibly, that means buying historic documents (Magna Carta, the Declaration of Independence, the Emancipation Proclamation) and restoring important sites (the Washington Monument, Monticello, the Lincoln Memorial). Two days before we meet, he announces $10m for the Jefferson Memorial in Washington.
Less visibly, and in the vein of his interviews for the Economic Club and Bloomberg and PBS, Rubenstein hosts “congressional dialogues”. At the Library of Congress, a bipartisan audience of representatives and senators mingles, dines and listens as Rubenstein interviews selected “master historians”.	Less visibly, and in the vein of his interviews for the Economic Club and Bloomberg and PBS, Rubenstein hosts “congressional dialogues”. At the Library of Congress, a bipartisan audience of representatives and senators mingles, dines and listens as Rubenstein interviews selected “master historians”.
The second you look down, you’ve lost the eye contact. It’s less a conversation	The second you look down, you’ve lost the eye contact. It’s less a conversation
Now comes a book, The American Story, which reprints 16 such discussions and aims to raise money for the library’s literacy programmes. The subjects and experts range from Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln (Jack D Warren, Jon Meacham, Doris Kearns Goodwin) to Lindbergh, King and Nixon (A Scott Berg, Taylor Branch, Bob Woodward).	Now comes a book, The American Story, which reprints 16 such discussions and aims to raise money for the library’s literacy programmes. The subjects and experts range from Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln (Jack D Warren, Jon Meacham, Doris Kearns Goodwin) to Lindbergh, King and Nixon (A Scott Berg, Taylor Branch, Bob Woodward).
The title is appropriate: this is history with the emphasis on story, clubbable rather than scholarly but not overly so. The interviews are readable, revealing, even surprisingly funny. Turn one page and HW Brands is revealing to an audience at least part-Republican Ronald Reagan’s lack of warmth to his children and failing memory while in the Oval Office. Turn another and Berg is detailing how Charles Lindbergh managed his solo Atlantic flight without recourse to a toilet.	The title is appropriate: this is history with the emphasis on story, clubbable rather than scholarly but not overly so. The interviews are readable, revealing, even surprisingly funny. Turn one page and HW Brands is revealing to an audience at least part-Republican Ronald Reagan’s lack of warmth to his children and failing memory while in the Oval Office. Turn another and Berg is detailing how Charles Lindbergh managed his solo Atlantic flight without recourse to a toilet.
Turn another, and Rubenstein is asking Jay Winik about Hitler: “What’s with that moustache?” As an interview technique, it’s idiosyncratic and not particularly hard-hitting, but it’s often productive.	Turn another, and Rubenstein is asking Jay Winik about Hitler: “What’s with that moustache?” As an interview technique, it’s idiosyncratic and not particularly hard-hitting, but it’s often productive.
“What I do when I do an interview,” he says, “is I always read the book or do a lot of research in advance. I write down the questions and then I kind of memorize the questions and I kind of have a logical way of doing it. And so if I have 35 questions, I’ll probably remember 32 or 33 and nobody will know but me that I forgot one.	“What I do when I do an interview,” he says, “is I always read the book or do a lot of research in advance. I write down the questions and then I kind of memorize the questions and I kind of have a logical way of doing it. And so if I have 35 questions, I’ll probably remember 32 or 33 and nobody will know but me that I forgot one.
“But also I think it helps with the eye contact. See, when you have a piece of paper, my theory is you look down. The second you look down, you’ve lost the eye contact. It’s less a conversation, more like an interview. That’s why I do it that way, but everybody has their own style. That’s just mine.”	“But also I think it helps with the eye contact. See, when you have a piece of paper, my theory is you look down. The second you look down, you’ve lost the eye contact. It’s less a conversation, more like an interview. That’s why I do it that way, but everybody has their own style. That’s just mine.”
True enough. My own research shows Rubenstein will devote the first part of any interview to interviewing his interviewer himself. Before I switch on the recorder he has established that I come from a city, Leeds, where he has ancestors thanks to an influx of Ukrainian Jews in the early 20th century.	True enough. My own research shows Rubenstein will devote the first part of any interview to interviewing his interviewer himself. Before I switch on the recorder he has established that I come from a city, Leeds, where he has ancestors thanks to an influx of Ukrainian Jews in the early 20th century.
The questions keep coming. Being quizzed by a titan of business, it turns out, is an unusual experience indeed.	The questions keep coming. Being quizzed by a titan of business, it turns out, is an unusual experience indeed.
Ask Bob Woodward. The great reporter sat down with Rubenstein to discuss Watergate, of course, but also what came after: Nixon’s final days, George W Bush and 9/11, Barack Obama, Afghanistan and Iraq.	Ask Bob Woodward. The great reporter sat down with Rubenstein to discuss Watergate, of course, but also what came after: Nixon’s final days, George W Bush and 9/11, Barack Obama, Afghanistan and Iraq.
Bob Woodward: 'Too many people are emotionally unhinged about Trump'	Bob Woodward: 'Too many people are emotionally unhinged about Trump'
They also talked about the time Woodward got a scoop on a memo written by a young aide in the Carter White House: Rubenstein.	They also talked about the time Woodward got a scoop on a memo written by a young aide in the Carter White House: Rubenstein.
“I remember it very clearly,” he says. “I would write a memo and I would put my boss’s name on it typically, but I might have had my name on this one as well. And this is what the essence of it was …	“I remember it very clearly,” he says. “I would write a memo and I would put my boss’s name on it typically, but I might have had my name on this one as well. And this is what the essence of it was …
“Carter went to Asia. He was going on the flight back to spend a day or two in Hawaii, recuperating. And the essence of it was [me] saying that, ‘We got gas lines here, it’s terrible. You shouldn’t really spend time in Hawaii, it wouldn’t look good. Just fly all the way back and you should know that the gas lines are a big problem and we need to blame the appropriate people, and let’s blame Opec for it.’”	“Carter went to Asia. He was going on the flight back to spend a day or two in Hawaii, recuperating. And the essence of it was [me] saying that, ‘We got gas lines here, it’s terrible. You shouldn’t really spend time in Hawaii, it wouldn’t look good. Just fly all the way back and you should know that the gas lines are a big problem and we need to blame the appropriate people, and let’s blame Opec for it.’”
He sent the memo to Carter, he says, “and then somebody, I guess, didn’t like the memo. And they leaked it to Bob Woodward.	He sent the memo to Carter, he says, “and then somebody, I guess, didn’t like the memo. And they leaked it to Bob Woodward.
“So Woodward is going to write an article, and he asked me about it, but he was going to write the article saying, Rubenstein and Stuart Eizenstat, my boss, tell the president he should blame Opec for the problems, not blame yourself. It was embarrassing to have your memo leak, and it didn’t make me popular. I didn’t know if I’d get fired or not.	“So Woodward is going to write an article, and he asked me about it, but he was going to write the article saying, Rubenstein and Stuart Eizenstat, my boss, tell the president he should blame Opec for the problems, not blame yourself. It was embarrassing to have your memo leak, and it didn’t make me popular. I didn’t know if I’d get fired or not.
“But anyway, that was what it was. And then Bob, later I got to know him.”	“But anyway, that was what it was. And then Bob, later I got to know him.”
In fact, in The American Story Woodward says the memo suggested “a war on Opec” – rather more than simple blame – and Rubenstein agrees.	In fact, in The American Story Woodward says the memo suggested “a war on Opec” – rather more than simple blame – and Rubenstein agrees.
Either way, Rubenstein soon realised he didn’t want to be a lawyer and went into finance instead. It worked out, and as he remained a voracious reader on “history, biography, politics and business” – he aims to ingest 100 books a year – and because his extraordinary wealth gave him extraordinary proximity to power, he started interviewing anyone who was anyone in each of those fields.	Either way, Rubenstein soon realised he didn’t want to be a lawyer and went into finance instead. It worked out, and as he remained a voracious reader on “history, biography, politics and business” – he aims to ingest 100 books a year – and because his extraordinary wealth gave him extraordinary proximity to power, he started interviewing anyone who was anyone in each of those fields.
The American Story has attracted criticism for being a book full of white men, both its subjects and those discussing them. Kearns Goodwin on Lincoln and the late Cokie Roberts on the Founding Mothers stand out, as does Branch’s great subject, Martin Luther King. But Rubenstein acknowledges the flaw.	The American Story has attracted criticism for being a book full of white men, both its subjects and those discussing them. Kearns Goodwin on Lincoln and the late Cokie Roberts on the Founding Mothers stand out, as does Branch’s great subject, Martin Luther King. But Rubenstein acknowledges the flaw.
“I have done another series of 18 or so dialogues,” he says, “and they have probably more women and more black authors. One of the authors I wanted to put in here was Annette Gordon-Reed, who wrote The Hemingses of Monticello, and it turned out the transcript didn’t quite work … I have done another interview of her and I’m going to put it in the next book or somewhere else.”	“I have done another series of 18 or so dialogues,” he says, “and they have probably more women and more black authors. One of the authors I wanted to put in here was Annette Gordon-Reed, who wrote The Hemingses of Monticello, and it turned out the transcript didn’t quite work … I have done another interview of her and I’m going to put it in the next book or somewhere else.”
Smithsonian's first black leader: 'There are still doors people can't get in'	Smithsonian's first black leader: 'There are still doors people can't get in'
He has also interviewed Lonnie Bunch, formerly director of the National Museum of African American History and Culture, now secretary of the Smithsonian, where Rubenstein is chair of the board.	He has also interviewed Lonnie Bunch, formerly director of the National Museum of African American History and Culture, now secretary of the Smithsonian, where Rubenstein is chair of the board.
“But I would say, yeah, the authors do not reflect the diversity of our country today. On the other hand, they do reflect some of the leading American historians, but you can always say I could do a better job, and I’d say, probably yes.”	“But I would say, yeah, the authors do not reflect the diversity of our country today. On the other hand, they do reflect some of the leading American historians, but you can always say I could do a better job, and I’d say, probably yes.”