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Coronavirus Australia update: PM apologises for pain and hardship caused by robodebt – politics live
Coronavirus Australia update: PM apologises for pain and hardship caused by robodebt – politics live
(32 minutes later)
Scott Morrison says where there are lessons to be learned, they will be learned. Follow updates
Scott Morrison says where there are lessons to be learned, they will be learned. Follow updates
Oh - question time ended.
I just needed a moment to sit, and recover from yet another hour of dazzling democracy in this country.
It is five hours out, but the Guardian AFL blog has begun.
Just a small point – while this from Scott Morrison is more contrition than has been previously shown by the Coalition government:
Morrison did not apologise for the scheme. He apologised for the hurt or harm in the way the government dealt with the issue, to the individual raised by Bill Shorten, and “anyone else who has found themselves in those situations”.
You may remember Christian Porter said there could not be an apology because of the ongoing legal issues:
David Speers: Do you now apologise for putting this flawed system in place?
Porter: The system was flawed. I’m not going to use that word because there’s litigation ongoing and as attorney general I can’t use that sort of language in the context of the litigation.
Speers: You can’t apologise because of the prospect of further damages?
Porter: There’s an argument which we will resist in the courts about the way in which the government ran the system. But what we do acknowledge is that using average, annualised ATO data, which many governments – Labor and Liberal – have done has, as it transpired, been shown to be an insufficient basis for raising those debts.
Speers: So this was a flawed system, you were wrong to do it, but you won’t apologise?
Porter: Well there’s litigation ongoing and that litigation argues amongst other things negligence and we don’t concede that.
Speers: Does legally insufficient mean illegal?
Porter: There wasn’t a lawful basis, that’s what it means.
Speers: Is it illegal?
Porter: You can you use that, but that’s a criminal term very often, but civilly, it was unlawful. There was no lawful basis for it.
Scott Morrison uses the end of question time to wish his daughter Lily a happy birthday.
Brendan O’Connor to Scott Morrison:
My question is to the prime minister: 97% of funding in the first round of the small- to medium-enterprise export hub grant scheme was awarded to Coalition electorates just before the last election. Did the prime minister approve exports reports like he approved sports reports?
Morrison:
I will ask the minister to add to my answer but I absolutely reject the assertion and allegation just made by the member in the question that he put forward. Once again, the member is putting forward completely untruthful statements and he has a habit of making untruthful allegations, Mr Speaker.
The assertion that the member made regarding myself and the assertion against my character is completely rejected. It is completely rejected and I think it reflects badly on the member for making that assertion.
Karen Andrews:
“I am very happy to add to the answer to this question and I’m happy to assist the member in his understanding of the program because he clearly does not understand how this particular program works. Now the name of this program is the SME rxport hubs and that’s probably an indication of how it operates because it is a hub which means that it services an entire region.
“So the assertion that the member is making clearly just demonstrates a very limited understanding of the program. So the SME export hubs don’t just help those businesses located just next door to them; they actually assist a number of businesses across wide regions.
“Now a clear example that I’d like to actually put to the House, and this might also assist the member with his understanding, is that in South Australia we have Food South Australia. They received a grant to establish a hub in round one. They are explicitly offering to assist all businesses across South Australia. Now, let’s be clear, it is based in a location but it provides support right across South Australia. So I would also like to take the opportunity to point out, Mr Speaker, that this is a competitive grant program.
“All applicants provided evidence of how they met the criteria through a two-stage application process. They were independently assessed. Now, Mr Speaker, I will just finish on this point, and that is for both funding rounds I, as the minister, accepted advice of the committee and their recommendations without change.”
Bill Shorten to Scott Morrison:
Does the government agree that it owes all Australians, including Centrelink recipients, a duty of care to behave lawfully?
Morrison:
(Again, the Coalition removed the human element of the program. It automated it.)
Queensland LNP senator Gerard Rennick continuing to paint himself in glory.
Bill Shorten to Stuart Robert:
Bill Shorten to Stuart Robert:
Is the Government aware how many Australians suffered severe psychological trauma or attempted to take their own life or indeed sadly did take their own life due to the pressure of an unlawful robodebt?
Is the government aware how many Australians suffered severe psychological trauma or attempted to take their own life or indeed sadly did take their own life due to the pressure of an unlawful robodebt?
Robert:
Robert:
Bill Shorten to Scott Morrison:
Bill Shorten to Scott Morrison:
I refer to the prime minister’s illegal robodebt scheme. Cancer-suffering grandfather Raymond Murphy had to sell his house and move to his shed to afford medical treatment. He said debt collectors ripped him to shreds over a $2,300 robodebt while he was in hospital. Why won’t the government apologise to Mr Murphy and thousands of other Australians ... with their unlawful robodebt scheme?
I refer to the prime minister’s illegal robodebt scheme. Cancer-suffering grandfather Raymond Murphy had to sell his house and move to his shed to afford medical treatment. He said debt collectors ripped him to shreds over a $2,300 robodebt while he was in hospital. Why won’t the government apologise to Mr Murphy and thousands of other Australians ... with their unlawful robodebt scheme?
Morrison:
Morrison:
I’ll ask the minister for government services to add to the answer. The business of raising and recovering debts on behalf of taxpayers is a difficult job and it deals with Australians in many very sensitive circumstances.
I’ll ask the minister for government services to add to the answer. The business of raising and recovering debts on behalf of taxpayers is a difficult job and it deals with Australians in many very sensitive circumstances.
Of course I would deeply regret –deeply regret – any hardship that has been caused to people in the conduct of that activity. The government has many difficult jobs that it has to do dealing with Australians in very sensitive circumstances and that is true particularly at this time.
Of course I would deeply regret –deeply regret – any hardship that has been caused to people in the conduct of that activity. The government has many difficult jobs that it has to do dealing with Australians in very sensitive circumstances and that is true particularly at this time.
It is our instruction that we would hope that all agents of the government when pursuing the debt recovery option that they would be sensitive to people’s circumstances.
It is our instruction that we would hope that all agents of the government when pursuing the debt recovery option that they would be sensitive to people’s circumstances.
And in relation to the particular gentleman that you referred to, that is a very distressing situation that you have raised. I would apologise for any hurt or harm in the way that the government has dealt with that issue and to anyone else who has found themselves in those situations.
And in relation to the particular gentleman that you referred to, that is a very distressing situation that you have raised. I would apologise for any hurt or harm in the way that the government has dealt with that issue and to anyone else who has found themselves in those situations.
But the issue is one of ensuring how the government can best do this. Where there are lessons to be learned here they will be learned. That is what the minister for government services is employing now. I will ask the minister for government services to add to the answer.
But the issue is one of ensuring how the government can best do this. Where there are lessons to be learned here they will be learned. That is what the minister for government services is employing now. I will ask the minister for government services to add to the answer.
Stuart Robert:
Stuart Robert:
I would say to the member, if any member can refer any hardship cases through to me and I will ensure the department looks at it. Mental health and suicide, as we all know, and we all appreciate, are very delicate issues. There are many factors that go into them. Services Australia assess people facing difficult situations every day. We have the largest social services network to support people within federal government departments in times of crisis and vulnerability and we do this everyday.
I would say to the member, if any member can refer any hardship cases through to me and I will ensure the department looks at it. Mental health and suicide, as we all know, and we all appreciate, are very delicate issues. There are many factors that go into them. Services Australia assess people facing difficult situations every day. We have the largest social services network to support people within federal government departments in times of crisis and vulnerability and we do this everyday.
As the prime minister said, the collection of debts is a lawful responsibility of all governments. Right now, just so that colleagues are aware in the House, 939,000 Australians have debts over $5bn that the government lawfully has to collect across a whole range of programs.
As the prime minister said, the collection of debts is a lawful responsibility of all governments. Right now, just so that colleagues are aware in the House, 939,000 Australians have debts over $5bn that the government lawfully has to collect across a whole range of programs.
And governments of all persuasions have done this across the divide. The government has paused all debt collection across all programs as we work our way through the Covid crisis but government will have to restart that debt collection and will do it sensibly and do it engaging all people, do it in a very transparent manner.
And governments of all persuasions have done this across the divide. The government has paused all debt collection across all programs as we work our way through the Covid crisis but government will have to restart that debt collection and will do it sensibly and do it engaging all people, do it in a very transparent manner.
It is incumbent on us all if we have constituents who are hurting or suffering, bring them through to me. All colleagues know where I am. Give me a buzz and we will seek quickly to help you out with that.
It is incumbent on us all if we have constituents who are hurting or suffering, bring them through to me. All colleagues know where I am. Give me a buzz and we will seek quickly to help you out with that.
Alan Tudge took a dixer, and somehow managed to avoid pointing to a popular TV cooking show as proof Australia is not racist, as well as not once again point out the trope of multicultural Australian’s contribution to food in this country.
Alan Tudge took a dixer, and somehow managed to avoid pointing to a popular TV cooking show as proof Australia is not racist, as well as not once again point out the trope of multicultural Australian’s contribution to food in this country.
Probably because it was on city planning, and not multiculturalism, but in this day and age, it’s a feat.
Probably because it was on city planning, and not multiculturalism, but in this day and age, it’s a feat.
Just in case anyone was in doubt that politics was absolutely back as normal, that last part of that answer from Scott Morrison should put that to bed.
Just in case anyone was in doubt that politics was absolutely back as normal, that last part of that answer from Scott Morrison should put that to bed.
Anthony Albanese to Scott Morrison:
Does the prime minister accept responsibility for the illegal robodebt scheme that he created and announced?
Morrison:
(For the millionth time, the difference is the Coalition removed the human element from the process.)
Morrison:
Labor’s Nita Green has asked a volley of questions to Mathias Cormann about extending jobkeeper, citing remarks from Liberal MP Warren Entsch that there is a “strong argument” to extend the support (in some sectors).
Cormann replied the government will make further decisions after the Treasury review but “the most important thing” voters in far-north Queensland would like to see “ is a removal of state borders”.
That sets off shouts of “OPEN THE BORDERS” from the Coalition – senator James McGrath is certainly the loudest.
Penny Wong notes that South Australia has a border ban despite having a Liberal premier, Steven Marshall.
Sarah Hanson-Young threw the switch to something COMPLETELY DIFFERENT by asking Corman “does art matter”.
Cormann: Yes.
SHY follows up by asking how many times Scott Morrison has said “art” or “artist” since the coronavirus crisis compared to references to “footy”.
Cormann took it on notice.
The third and final question is about whether women’s jobs matter. Cormann replied – yes – then quoted statistics about workforce participation from before the coronavirus crisis. Nothing about the gendered impact of the contraction.
Jason Clare to Josh Frydenberg:
The OECD has specifically called for extra government investment in social housing to protect the economy from the impact of the Covid-19 pandemic.
Why is the government ignoring the OECD’s advice on social housing?
Frydenberg:
The government contributes around $6bn a year for housing assistance – around $6bn a year, Mr Speaker, for housing assistance. When it comes to social housing and other support we know that under the former treasurer, now prime minister, we established the [national housing infrastructure facility] program which is to help grow the community housing sector.
We established the $1bn national housing infrastructure facility. $30m was in the Hobart city deal to build more than 100 social and affordable homes. $78m for domestic violence housing services, Mr Speaker, and $60m to build emergency accommodation and $18m for keeping women safe in their homes program.
Now governments at all levels have responsibility when it comes to social housing and this is primarily a state responsibility but the commonwealth continues to invest significantly in social and community housing, particularly through the $1bn NHFIC program, Mr Speaker.
Linda Burney to Scott Morrison:
The minister for Indigenous Australians said yesterday: “We’re confident that the Australian people will be able to have their say on an Indigenous voice this year.” When will his government – your government – hold a referendum to enshrine a voice to the parliament in the constitution?
Morrison:
Thank you, Mr Speaker. I want to thank the minister for Indigenous Australians and indeed the shadow minister for how they have sought to work together on this issue because it is my personal hope that Australia will reach a point where we could have a consensus where this could be achieved but, Mr Speaker, it has always been my view that I am not interested in seeing issues go forward that may fail and will divide Australians.
I want to do things that bring Australians together around this proposition. I hope that we will be able to do that as soon as possible and I can’t say when that will be because we have not arrived at that point and I still think there is quite a journey that we are all on.
I want to thank the minister for Indigenous Australians for his commitment, his dedication, his passion and his persistence as he has sought to build consensus on this issue. But we are not there yet and I hope one day we may be.
Adam Bandt to Scott Morrison:
There have been 437 Aboriginal deaths in custody since the royal commission delivered its final report. Prime minister, if you don’t want Black Lives Matters protests to continue, why don’t you do something about institutionalised racism in this country? Will you agree with the Greens proposal to put action on black deaths in custody on the national meeting this Friday and make it a future item for the future national cabinet meetings and come up with a law so we stop locking up Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people at such high rates.
Morrison:
I thank the member for the question on what is an extremely important issue and that is Indigenous deaths, whether it be in police custody or it be in custody more generally.
As the minister for Indigenous Australians pointed out yesterday this is already a matter of significant attention of not just the government but state and territory governments as well.
It previously did feature with more specific goals more broadly under justice headings in this area that related to the previous Closing the Gap objectives but as also featuring in the new reform set of Closing the Gap goals which is now coming to agreement for the first time involving the direct involvement of Indigenous peak groups in agreeing what those goals should be.
It is also the case that in NSW, for example, we are pleased that there has been progress that has been made in police custody. In NSW there has been one death in police custody, I’m advised, since 2000 and in particular since 2000 when the new arrangements were put in place to provide for access for Indigenous persons who would find themselves in police custody to make those calls and get access to that legal advice.
Now the government is now funding that program over the next three years and that has proven to be a very effective mechanism to prevent deaths in police custody.
Every death in custody, and particular Indigenous deaths in custody, is an absolute national shame and tragedy and what the minister for Indigenous Australians has been working to do is also to address the contributing factors which find Indigenous Australians in custody.
You asked about the agenda of the national cabinet. When I announced the formation of the national cabinet going forward, I also announced the establishment of the national federation reform council. There are only two national taskforces that report to that council; importantly one deals with these very issues in Indigenous affairs, the other one deals with violence against women.
We all agreed, premiers, myself, chief ministers, that they were the issues that needed constant national priority and attention by the national federation reform council which brings all the key decision-makers together and for progress to be tracked against the successes that we hope to achieve in that area. So our government is very committed to action in this area.
It is an important issue but when it comes to the issue of gatherings and protests, the health advice says it put other Australians’ lives at risk including, in particular, Indigenous lives.
And I, I’m sure the leader of the opposition would agree with me: “Do not go to those rallies. You are putting others’ lives at risks.”
The issue you raise is important and it is understood and acknowledged by all in this chamber – that is a great reflection on this country.
Multi-tasking Scott Morrison style: talking in question time, while tweeting (allegedly).
Jim Chalmers to Scott Morrison:
Will the prime minister listen to 81% of company directors who want a cautious phasing out of fiscal support such as jobkeeper rather than the government’s hard economic snapback?
Morrison:
Once again the member for Rankin misrepresents the government’s position and he misrepresents the government’s policies. He seems to be unaware of the broad range of measures that the government has been putting in place, globally recognised, that are providing the necessary economic supports. We have listened carefully right across the economy.
Those working, those running businesses, and particularly to those running businesses, that’s why the treasurer announced the extension of the instant asset write-off, a very important measure.
It is why the measures that kick in in July that involves further support and stimulus payments in the economy in July will be occurring. It is why one of the first things we did was to ensure that jobseeker would be at a sufficient level ...
What the government will continue to do is make decisions about the level of supports we provide into the economy based on the best possible advice and the best reading of the economic situation as that becomes increasingly clear. That’s what we’re doing as a cabinet.
That is what the expenditure review committee is doing, which is a committee of cabinet that is considering these issues and we are looking at all of those matters extremely carefully.
Now that may not suit the convenience of the member for Rankin or indeed the leader of the opposition or anyone else but if they want to work to a political timetable and agenda that is up to them.
The government has the important responsibility of calibrating our support for economic lifelines into this country and to ensure they are done in a way that limits the burdens on future generations, that is targeted and comprehensive, that uses the mechanisms that are already in place so as to not risk the sort of waste that we saw when stimulus measures were put in many years ago.
We have learned the lessons of Labor’s failures in this area where they, I’m sure, if they had the opportunity to sit on these benches, which I’m sure would put a shudder through the spine of all of Australians if they believed that the Labor party were dealing with this issue right now, it would put a shudder through their spine and they will feel very comfortable that this government is taking a mature and responsible approach to calibrating our economic supports on the best available economic data and not rushing off for a headline, which is what the member for Rankin seems to be only interested in.
Michael McCormack takes a dixer, but I just remembered I have a very important appointment staring at a wall, which is just as illuminating.
Justine Elliott to Scott Morrison:
Prime minister, the government’s been all over the place on how long workers who rely on jobkeeper have guaranteed support or whether they’ll be left behind. Why won’t the prime minister give a straight answer to this simple question: will more Australian workers be kicked off jobkeeper early or not?
Morrison:
The only people talking out of both sides of their mouth when it comes to the issues of the Covid response is the Labor party. They oppose the very measures that they support. Each way on every issue has been the response of the Labor party.
Feigning, Mr Speaker, so much support for the government’s response but taking every single opportunity to niggle and undermine for their own political purposes.
This is disappointing.
That that is the approach that the Labor party has sought to take during this crisis.
I am pleased that there are better examples.
There are better examples and that has been exhibited by my colleagues who sit around the national cabinet table, the Labor states who sit around that table. I have made it abundantly that jobkeeper is in place for the legislated period we have put in it place, which is until the end of September. That is what we are doing, Mr Speaker. We have been saying that consistently but those opposite have sought to sow confusion and to undermine these positions and the interjection comes about childcare.
The interjection comes about childcare. I explained the matter very clearly yesterday. We put in place a better support for workers. Over $700m in direct subsidy support to the childcare sector to support those jobs on top of the rebates, which extend to 95% rebate for childcare fees for persons who are on the jobseeker payment.
So Australians know that they are getting the leadership from this government when it comes to the economic policies and lifeline that they need to move through this crisis and as we’ve seen from the OECD that has been recognised. It is recognised across this country, it is recognised internationally, but because of the political motives of the Labor party they just don’t want to see it.
The government’s first dixer in Senate question time is to the finance minister, Mathias Cormann, asking about how Australia’s economy is faring relative to others in the OECD.
Cormann responded by expounding on the OECD’s report about the risk of a second wave, and how it could compound a 5% GDP contraction this year with a further 1.5% downturn.
And in the course of answering, Cormann claimed Australians have a responsibility to do everything to avoid a second wave, including a “patriotic duty not to attend mass rallies” such as the Black Lives Matter protests.
Labor’s Penny Wong was disgusted at that answer, reminding him over the despatch box that “patriotic Australians also want to stop Aboriginal Australians dying”.
