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| REM's Mike Mills: 'To expose yourself, warts and all, was very daunting' | REM's Mike Mills: 'To expose yourself, warts and all, was very daunting' |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| In the summer of 1990, REM guitarist Peter Buck acquired a mandolin, the idea being that playing a new instrument | In the summer of 1990, REM guitarist Peter Buck acquired a mandolin, the idea being that playing a new instrument |
| might provide a different way of writing songs. While he was learning to play | might provide a different way of writing songs. While he was learning to play |
| it, he came up with a distinctive riff, which became the basis of a new song. | it, he came up with a distinctive riff, which became the basis of a new song. |
| “It was pretty much done by the time he played it for us,” remembers the band's bassist, Mike | “It was pretty much done by the time he played it for us,” remembers the band's bassist, Mike |
| Mills. “We finished it | Mills. “We finished it |
| off at the rehearsal place and then recorded it. The things that Michael, | off at the rehearsal place and then recorded it. The things that Michael, |
| [Stipe, singer] Bill [Berry, drummer] and I brought to it changed it a little | [Stipe, singer] Bill [Berry, drummer] and I brought to it changed it a little |
| bit, but it was pretty much as it was.” By the time the band recorded the tune | bit, but it was pretty much as it was.” By the time the band recorded the tune |
| – which now had lyrics, and a title, Losing My Religion – they knew it was | – which now had lyrics, and a title, Losing My Religion – they knew it was |
| rather special, but they had to convince their record company to release it | |
| and had no idea that it would have any particular commercial appeal above any | and had no idea that it would have any particular commercial appeal above any |
| of their other material. | of their other material. |
| “Are | “Are |
| you kidding?” Mills says. “It’s a five-minute song with a mandolin | you kidding?” Mills says. “It’s a five-minute song with a mandolin |
| and no chorus. We never thought in terms of hits anyway, but there was no way | and no chorus. We never thought in terms of hits anyway, but there was no way |
| we could have predicted how many people would have liked that song.” | we could have predicted how many people would have liked that song.” |
| In | In |
| fact, Losing My | fact, Losing My |
| Religion became REM’s biggest worldwide hit, reaching N0 4 in the US – where | Religion became REM’s biggest worldwide hit, reaching N0 4 in the US – where |
| it spent 21 weeks in the Billboard Hot 100 – and the UK top 20, picking up | it spent 21 weeks in the Billboard Hot 100 – and the UK top 20, picking up |
| awards by the truckload and becoming something of a signature song among the | awards by the truckload and becoming something of a signature song among the |
| band’s considerable canon. Their appeal had broadened with each successive album – Murmur, Reckoning, Fables of the | band’s considerable canon. Their appeal had broadened with each successive album – Murmur, Reckoning, Fables of the |
| Reconstruction, Lifes Rich Pageant, Document and Green – but Losing My Religion became ubiquitous in pubs and clubs and cars | |
| around the globe. | around the globe. |
| Reading on a mobile? Click here to watch the video for Losing My Religion. | |
| Largely on the back of that song, 1991’s Out of Time | Largely on the back of that song, 1991’s Out of Time |
| shattered expectations of two or so million sales to sell more than 18m copies, kickstarting the group’s 1990s ascension to the status of one of the biggest bands | |
| in the world.“It | in the world.“It |
| marked the transition from pretty big to really big,” Mills remembers. | marked the transition from pretty big to really big,” Mills remembers. |
| “Although for us it felt gradual. We were really lucky in that every record up | “Although for us it felt gradual. We were really lucky in that every record up |
| to Automatic For The People [1992] and maybe Monster [1994], sold more than the | to Automatic For The People [1992] and maybe Monster [1994], sold more than the |
| one before it. So it felt very natural and organic, rather than this big | one before it. So it felt very natural and organic, rather than this big |
| avalanche of notoriety.” | avalanche of notoriety.” |
| We’re | We’re |
| talking about this now because Losing My Religion is the only song that appears | talking about this now because Losing My Religion is the only song that appears |
| twice on Unplugged 1991/2001, The Complete Sessions, a newly released | |
| acoustic live album featuring two long-unheard performances recorded at MTV’s | acoustic live album featuring two long-unheard performances recorded at MTV’s |
| New York studios, which capture the band at two pivotal moments in their | New York studios, which capture the band at two pivotal moments in their |
| career. The 1991 appearance was recorded just as Losing My Religion had | career. The 1991 appearance was recorded just as Losing My Religion had |
| exploded; the 2001 performance finds the band, by this point minus Berry, | exploded; the 2001 performance finds the band, by this point minus Berry, |
| reinventing themselves all over again. | reinventing themselves all over again. |
| Stipe | Stipe |
| once described the 1991 rollercoaster as a process of “trying to retain sanity, | once described the 1991 rollercoaster as a process of “trying to retain sanity, |
| not suck and not sell out”. Was that how it felt? “Yes, | not suck and not sell out”. Was that how it felt? “Yes, |
| it’s a balancing act, for sure,” Mills says. “You want to be grateful and | it’s a balancing act, for sure,” Mills says. “You want to be grateful and |
| graceful about your success, and at the same time not let it go to your heads. | graceful about your success, and at the same time not let it go to your heads. |
| That was one of the reasons we never moved to New York City. Staying in Athens | That was one of the reasons we never moved to New York City. Staying in Athens |
| [Georgia] helped us keep our feet on the ground. When you’re on tour or in the | [Georgia] helped us keep our feet on the ground. When you’re on tour or in the |
| big city, people know you and want to talk to you. Then you go home and your | big city, people know you and want to talk to you. Then you go home and your |
| friends know you and tell you what a dumbass you are. It kinda brings you back | friends know you and tell you what a dumbass you are. It kinda brings you back |
| down to earth.” | down to earth.” |
| Otherwise, much else was changing. With Losing My Religion, the band had | Otherwise, much else was changing. With Losing My Religion, the band had |
| realised that they were able to | realised that they were able to |
| write songs that could connect universally, which Mills says felt empowering. | write songs that could connect universally, which Mills says felt empowering. |
| “It’s | “It’s |
| kinda satisfying, to know that your music resonates in such a way that that | kinda satisfying, to know that your music resonates in such a way that that |
| many people like it and it gives you the chance to do what you love for a lot | many people like it and it gives you the chance to do what you love for a lot |
| more people. We were able to go to all sorts of places and do this thing we | more people. We were able to go to all sorts of places and do this thing we |
| really loved. We never thought numbers. You’d never think how many people were | really loved. We never thought numbers. You’d never think how many people were |
| listening to a song like Losing …. There’s no point analysing it, what you’re | |
| doing is organic and it comes from a place in the heart rather than thought. | doing is organic and it comes from a place in the heart rather than thought. |
| You do what you do whether there’s 10 people or a million people.” | You do what you do whether there’s 10 people or a million people.” |
| After | After |
| years | years |
| on independent label IRS, 1989’s Green marked the first of many | on independent label IRS, 1989’s Green marked the first of many |
| records for Warner Brothers. Although Mills has | records for Warner Brothers. Although Mills has |
| sympathy for | sympathy for |
| those who regard the shift in record companies marking two distinct | those who regard the shift in record companies marking two distinct |
| phases of | phases of |
| the group, he insists not much had changed apart from the fact that | the group, he insists not much had changed apart from the fact that |
| he | he |
| finally owned a house and felt secure in his career. However, there were | finally owned a house and felt secure in his career. However, there were |
| some | some |
| new pressures. As well as having to coax Warners into releasing Losing My Religion as a single, going against the record company's | new pressures. As well as having to coax Warners into releasing Losing My Religion as a single, going against the record company's |
| wishes in refusing to tour Out of Time (because | wishes in refusing to tour Out of Time (because |
| they needed to recharge after gruelling years spent on the road) also | they needed to recharge after gruelling years spent on the road) also |
| suggests a | suggests a |
| certain unease with the new, far more commercial world they were now in. | certain unease with the new, far more commercial world they were now in. |
| Reading on a mobile? Click here to watch the video for Radio Free Europe. | |
| The MTV | The MTV |
| appearance was a way of reaching millions without hitting the road and found the band in one way | appearance was a way of reaching millions without hitting the road and found the band in one way |
| at the | at the |
| peak of their powers, but strangely vulnerable. Listened | peak of their powers, but strangely vulnerable. Listened |
| to now, it’s an extraordinary recording. At the beginning of the show at least – Stipe (who was just becoming a superstar and perhaps realising that life | to now, it’s an extraordinary recording. At the beginning of the show at least – Stipe (who was just becoming a superstar and perhaps realising that life |
| would never be quite the same again) sounds unusually nervous. | would never be quite the same again) sounds unusually nervous. |
| “I | “I |
| think we were all nervous,” Mills says. “The last time we’d really played | think we were all nervous,” Mills says. “The last time we’d really played |
| before that was the 89 tour, which was full on, big PAs, big amplifiers, and also MTV was really big at that point. We knew there was a big audience. So to sit there and expose | before that was the 89 tour, which was full on, big PAs, big amplifiers, and also MTV was really big at that point. We knew there was a big audience. So to sit there and expose |
| yourself, warts and all, was very daunting. You really have to get yourself up | |
| for that.” | for that.” |
| Mills remembers the fact that there was a small | Mills remembers the fact that there was a small |
| audience – some friends but mostly fans, after the band had to “work with” MTV | audience – some friends but mostly fans, after the band had to “work with” MTV |
| to ensure it wasn’t made up of industry people – in the room as being “as daunting as | |
| anything, because of the immediacy. So you’ve got that factor and the fact that | anything, because of the immediacy. So you’ve got that factor and the fact that |
| its being recorded for posterity so you don’t want to mess that part of it up | its being recorded for posterity so you don’t want to mess that part of it up |
| either." | either." |
| After | After |
| Radio Song, three songs in, Stipe reassures himself – “Not bad” – and you can | Radio Song, three songs in, Stipe reassures himself – “Not bad” – and you can |
| almost hear the nerves evaporating. It becomes a great performance by a band | almost hear the nerves evaporating. It becomes a great performance by a band |
| starting to embrace their history and their enormity. In | starting to embrace their history and their enormity. In |
| today’s marketing-driven world, the choice of tracks seems unusual. Mills | today’s marketing-driven world, the choice of tracks seems unusual. Mills |
| insists REM had no time for retrospection at that point, and were | insists REM had no time for retrospection at that point, and were |
| focused on the “present or the near future, all the time”. And yet, there they | |
| were, on a relatively new label with an album to promote, playing a set | were, on a relatively new label with an album to promote, playing a set |
| containing swathes of songs – Disturbance at the Heron House, It’s The End Of | containing swathes of songs – Disturbance at the Heron House, It’s The End Of |
| The World As We Know (And I Feel Fine), an ethereal Perfect | The World As We Know (And I Feel Fine), an ethereal Perfect |
| Circle and a | Circle and a |
| sublime Fall On Me (which Stipe introduces as “my favourite song from the | sublime Fall On Me (which Stipe introduces as “my favourite song from the |
| REM catalogue") – from much earlier in their career, when they were far from | REM catalogue") – from much earlier in their career, when they were far from |
| the ultra-mainstream. | |
| Was that because you felt that they were good songs as well, and that | Was that because you felt that they were good songs as well, and that |
| the wider world should hear them too, or was it a reticence to play the | the wider world should hear them too, or was it a reticence to play the |
| promotional game of the world you were now in? | promotional game of the world you were now in? |
| “It was a bit of both. We never did things as we were supposed to do. | “It was a bit of both. We never did things as we were supposed to do. |
| That was part of our ethic. We did what felt right to us, not what someone told | That was part of our ethic. We did what felt right to us, not what someone told |
| us we should do. We did want to play some of the old songs. It was much more | us we should do. We did want to play some of the old songs. It was much more |
| than a promotional show. We never thought in that manner: every show was a | than a promotional show. We never thought in that manner: every show was a |
| specific event and we’d always try to make them special. We wanted to hear how | specific event and we’d always try to make them special. We wanted to hear how |
| some of the older songs would sound under the acoustic spotlight.” | some of the older songs would sound under the acoustic spotlight.” |
| Another curveball is a beautiful Mills-sung cover of the Troggs’ Love Is | Another curveball is a beautiful Mills-sung cover of the Troggs’ Love Is |
| All | All |
| Around. | Around. |
| As the bassist tells it, he and Buck had found an old 45 of the song in a | As the bassist tells it, he and Buck had found an old 45 of the song in a |
| garage sale and had started covering it. “We really enjoyed playing it, so | |
| tossed it in.” | tossed it in.” |
| Reading on a mobile? Click here to watch the video for Love Is All Around. | |
| Three years later, a near-identical arrangement of the same song would | Three years later, a near-identical arrangement of the same song would |
| be an international hit for Wet Wet Wet, which Mills admits was a bit odd. | be an international hit for Wet Wet Wet, which Mills admits was a bit odd. |
| “I don’t know if they got the idea from us or they were Troggs fans,” he | “I don’t know if they got the idea from us or they were Troggs fans,” he |
| says, sounding quizzical. “The thing about that song … Love Is All Around is | says, sounding quizzical. “The thing about that song … Love Is All Around is |
| actually a much better song than Wild Thing.” A chuckle. “Wild Thing’s not the | actually a much better song than Wild Thing.” A chuckle. “Wild Thing’s not the |
| sort of thing we’d have done at MTV Unplugged.” | sort of thing we’d have done at MTV Unplugged.” |
| By the time, REM returned to the MTV studios a decade later, they | By the time, REM returned to the MTV studios a decade later, they |
| were minus Bill Berry, after he suffered a brain aneurysm and succumbed to increasing | were minus Bill Berry, after he suffered a brain aneurysm and succumbed to increasing |
| disenchantment with the demands of being in a globally enormous group. | disenchantment with the demands of being in a globally enormous group. |
| It was the band’s first line-up change | It was the band’s first line-up change |
| since forming in 1980, after Stipe and Buck had met in Athens’ Wuxtry | since forming in 1980, after Stipe and Buck had met in Athens’ Wuxtry |
| Records and bonded over a love of the Velvet Underground and Television. | Records and bonded over a love of the Velvet Underground and Television. |
| “It | “It |
| took some getting used to, for sure,” Mills says of Berry’s departure, | took some getting used to, for sure,” Mills says of Berry’s departure, |
| which was long rued by many fans. “We had to decide if we were going to keep | which was long rued by many fans. “We had to decide if we were going to keep |
| going and then we had to decide how we were going to keep going, and view it as | going and then we had to decide how we were going to keep going, and view it as |
| an opportunity rather than a setback. It certainly freed us up to do anything | an opportunity rather than a setback. It certainly freed us up to do anything |
| we wanted to so we took advantage of that and tried to branch out in different | we wanted to so we took advantage of that and tried to branch out in different |
| directions.” | directions.” |
| You | You |
| can hear that in the separate performances. Even though both are | can hear that in the separate performances. Even though both are |
| acoustic, the 2001 set – largely from that year’s Reveal album –sounds more | acoustic, the 2001 set – largely from that year’s Reveal album –sounds more |
| fragile, almost redemptive. Even a turbulent and caustic song such as The One I | fragile, almost redemptive. Even a turbulent and caustic song such as The One I |
| Love sounds more becalmed and | Love sounds more becalmed and |
| regretful: | regretful: |
| markedly different from the original. | markedly different from the original. |
| “It | “It |
| was new when Bill left the band, but it was part of that process of constant | was new when Bill left the band, but it was part of that process of constant |
| growth and change,” says Mills. “Bill just accelerated the process. It was 10 | growth and change,” says Mills. “Bill just accelerated the process. It was 10 |
| years on, we were a different band. We approached it with a different mindset; | years on, we were a different band. We approached it with a different mindset; |
| we were older and more experienced. Did I miss Bill? Yes and no. It wasn’t like | we were older and more experienced. Did I miss Bill? Yes and no. It wasn’t like |
| he was dead. He wasn’t happy, and all that mattered was that he was happy. If | he was dead. He wasn’t happy, and all that mattered was that he was happy. If |
| he’s happier staying at home then by all means stay at home.” | he’s happier staying at home then by all means stay at home.” |
| Which is pretty much what Mills did himself after REM finally | Which is pretty much what Mills did himself after REM finally |
| disbanded in 2011. He took a year off | disbanded in 2011. He took a year off |
| to tend to his ill mother, but after she died plunged himself back into work. | to tend to his ill mother, but after she died plunged himself back into work. |
| As we speak, he’s en route to Madrid to play with Joseph | As we speak, he’s en route to Madrid to play with Joseph |
| Arthur, and he and Buck still | Arthur, and he and Buck still |
| play together in the Baseball | play together in the Baseball |
| Project. Ending the group that made them all famous was, he says, “sad and bittersweet but it was the | Project. Ending the group that made them all famous was, he says, “sad and bittersweet but it was the |
| right time, and we all felt that it was the right thing to do at the time. | right time, and we all felt that it was the right thing to do at the time. |
| We’re all pretty much at peace with it. I know I am.” | We’re all pretty much at peace with it. I know I am.” |
| • Unplugged 1991 & 2001: The Complete Sessions is out now on | • Unplugged 1991 & 2001: The Complete Sessions is out now on |
| Rhino | Rhino |
| Reading on a mobile? Click here to watch the video for Pretty Persuasion. |