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STV smokes Salmond out on an independence debate with Darling STV smokes Salmond out on an independence debate with Darling
(2 months later)
So has Alex Salmond been pushed into an So has Alex Salmond been pushed into an early debate with Alistair Darling?
early debate with Alistair Darling? For months the first minister has sought to dominate the agenda on one of the most important set piece moments of the referendum campaign by insisting on a televised confrontation with David Cameron.
For months the first minister has But the broadcaster STV appears to have forced Salmond's hand – if you believe his opponents.
sought to dominate the agenda on one of the most important set piece At the weekend, the Sunday Herald disclosed that STV has invited the first minister and Alistair Darling, chairman of the anti-independence Better Together campaign, to take part in a two-hour long referendum debate on 16 July.
moments of the referendum campaign by insisting on a televised Alistair Darling, leader of the Better Together pro-UK campaign, immediately said yes. Salmond, a wily operator, has given the broadcaster a curiously contorted half-yes: he will do it if the prime minister agrees to his challenge but won't if Cameron's answer is no.
confrontation with David Cameron. But, significantly, that veto on facing Darling only lasts for a few weeks: he will eventually say yes to debating Darling, just not now.
But the broadcaster STV appears to have forced Salmond has long been running a twin track strategy of demanding a one-on-one with Cameron knowing it was highly unlikely the resolutely opposed prime minister would ever agree, while in parallel quietly paving an escape route which leads inexorably to a debate with Darling.
Salmond's hand – if you believe his opponents. According to Better Together, STV plans to go ahead with the debate regardless, effectively forcing Salmond into reluctantly agreeing or finding a deputy to do so for him. Neither option is ideal for the first minister.
At the weekend, the Sunday Herald Blair McDougall, director of campaigns at Better Together, said the channel is resolute:
disclosed that STV has invited the first minister and Alistair STV came to us and said 'we're holding a debate on the 16th. If you don't send someone, we will either 'empty chair' you or find someone not of your choice.' We said 'yes' and Salmond has said I won't do it on that date [against Darling]. STV, as far as we're aware, are still saying it's the 16th.
Darling, chairman of the anti-independence Better Together campaign, STV is refusing to confirm or deny McDougall's reading: Salmond's office insists it is not impressed and has no plans to nominate an alternative, say Nicola Sturgeon, to debate Darling.
to take part in a two-hour long referendum debate on 16 July. Instead, Salmond's office has sought to sidestep STV's programming decisions by ignoring the broadcaster's invitation to Darling (and Darling's acceptance of that invitation) and instead writing to Downing Street challenging Cameron to take Darling's place.
Alistair Darling, leader of the Better There is, says Salmond chief spokesman, no debate yet happening on the 16th, only a proposal for one:
Together pro-UK campaign, immediately said yes. Salmond, a wily To be absolutely clear, July 16th is only going to happen if the prime minister accepts. That is the basis on which we're clearly proceeding.
operator, has given the broadcaster a curiously contorted half-yes: STV might disagree with that. After all, it decides on what programmes it screens and who it invites, not the first minister's office – a position made clear in the exchange of letters between Salmond's office and STV's head of news, Gordon Macmillan, last week.
he will do it if the prime minister agrees to his challenge but won't But asked about McDougall's account that this programme will happen regardless of Salmond's answer, STV won't say.
if Cameron's answer is no. It needs to hear back finally and formally from both sides first, its spokeswoman said, clearly implying that STV is far from convinced that Salmond's refusal to face Darling is final:
But, significantly, that veto on facing Our position is that an invitation has gone to Alistair Darling and Alex Salmond to debate on 16th July and until we've heard back from all parties we don't want to speculate on how or when or anything.
Darling only lasts for a few weeks: he will eventually say yes to The first minister has replied with a note that they've sent to David Cameron and they're waiting to hear back from Downing Street before coming back to STV. Our position is that the 16th July is the date we've proposed to both sides and it has been [proposed] to Alistair Darling and Alex Salmond.
debating Darling, just not now. The main difficulty with McDougall's reading is that STV might actually only want Salmond when it comes down to it: no first minister on 16 July means no decent audience, so no debate. After all, they've now landed Salmond's written agreement to debate Darling later in the campaign.
Salmond has long been running a twin As far as brinksmanship goes, this is hardly the Cuban missile crisis. Outside the political bubble, it will seem remarkably minor. Yet it matters. If there are as many as one million voters yet to choose or finally decide the referendum's outcome, the debate winner's rhetoric and skill could have a decisive effect.
track strategy of demanding a one-on-one with Cameron knowing it was Setting aside his stunning fall from grace since then, think of Liberal Democrat leader Nick Clegg's attention-griping performances in the 2010 general election debates. In France and the US, presidential TV debates can have great significance on popular consciousness: they can set the tone and the morale of the campaigns.
highly unlikely the resolutely opposed prime minister would ever Yet this is now turning to out to be remarkably messy, thanks to this summer's congested events timetable, the summer holidays and their impact on the rhythms and tempo of the campaign. And thanks, in part, to STV.
agree, while in parallel quietly paving an escape route which leads That date is convenient for STV: the broadcaster wants to stage the debate as part of its Scottish 500 series at the Assembly Rooms in central Edinburgh, its usual venue for that show, with an invited audience of 500 voters.
inexorably to a debate with Darling. But the Assembly Rooms is also a key venue for the Edinburgh Fringe festival, and the 16th is the only date it will be free until September. Any earlier, it clashes with the World Cup which ends on 13 July. And any later in July, and the Commonwealth Games begin in Glasgow. So STV, it seems, has had its hand forced too.
According to Better Together, STV plans But that date is far from convenient for Salmond: as this blog reported last month, he and his strategists want to stage the debates far closer to polling day – ideally just before about one million of Scotland's 4m voters start to receive their postal votes on 25 August, at a point when the final campaign is in full swing.
to go ahead with the debate regardless, effectively forcing Salmond Both campaigns are planning an intense push in mid to late August to influence and capture those postal votes.
into reluctantly agreeing or finding a deputy to do so for him. Go too early – in July, and the debate will be competing for an audience already depleted by the school holidays with the 2014 Glasgow games, the First World War commemorations in early August and the final stages of the world cup.
Neither option is ideal for the first minister. Go too late, you miss influencing those crucial postal votes – these are the committed electors who are far more likely to take part but conversely to have made up their minds; you may be talking to an increasingly weary and committed electorate and you also have too little time to fix any disasters from the debate.
Blair McDougall, director of campaigns And for the yes campaign, still lagging behind in the polls, timing is critical: Salmond may be a divisive character for many voters, but he is rightly famous for his sharp debating skills and his ease on a stage. He is an asset which his team needs to play very cleverly indeed.
at Better Together, said the channel is resolute: For political anoraks, there is a more interesting side effect of STV's gambit: they have broken free from the broadcasting pack, and clearly shown there is no chance of the three main broadcasters – BBC, STV and Sky – screening that carefully choreographed sequence of set piece leaders' debates we saw in the 2010 general election.
STV came to us and said 'we're McDougall says that any hopes of the three broadcasters and the two campaigns agreeing to that package evaporated some time ago.
holding a debate on the 16th. If you don't send someone, we will That may be partly Better Together's doing: it began raising some pretty detailed requirements about the staging and arrangements for the proposed debates at an early stage, drawing on the expertise of some of its teams in setting up the 2010 prime ministerial debates.
either 'empty chair' you or find someone not of your choice.' We said The tortuous detail involved in staging those events has left the broadcasters still carrying the “scar tissue”. They had little appetite for a repeat of that experience.
'yes' and Salmond has said I won't do it on that date [against
Darling]. STV, as far as we're aware, are still saying it's the
16th.
STV is refusing to confirm or deny
McDougall's reading: Salmond's office insists it is not impressed and
has no plans to nominate an alternative, say Nicola Sturgeon, to
debate Darling.
Instead, Salmond's office has sought to
sidestep STV's programming decisions by ignoring the broadcaster's
invitation to Darling (and Darling's acceptance of that invitation)
and instead writing to Downing Street challenging Cameron to take
Darling's place.
There is, says Salmond chief spokesman,
no debate yet happening on the 16th, only a proposal for
one:
To be absolutely clear, July 16th
is only going to happen if the prime minister accepts. That is the
basis on which we're clearly proceeding.
STV might disagree with that. After
all, it decides on what programmes it screens and who it invites, not
the first minister's office – a position made clear in the exchange
of letters between Salmond's office and STV's head of news, Gordon
Macmillan, last week.
But asked about McDougall's account
that this programme will happen regardless of Salmond's answer, STV
won't say.
It needs to hear back finally and
formally from both sides first, its spokeswoman said, clearly
implying that STV is far from convinced that Salmond's refusal to
face Darling is final:
Our position is that an invitation
has gone to Alistair Darling and Alex Salmond to debate on 16th
July and until we've heard back from all parties we don't want to
speculate on how or when or anything.
The first minister has replied with
a note that they've sent to David Cameron and they're waiting to hear
back from Downing Street before coming back to STV. Our position is
that the 16th July is the date we've proposed to both
sides and it has been [proposed] to Alistair Darling and Alex
Salmond.
The main difficulty with McDougall's
reading is that STV might actually only want Salmond when it comes
down to it: no first minister on 16 July means no decent audience, so
no debate. After all, they've now landed Salmond's written agreement
to debate Darling later in the campaign.
As far as brinksmanship goes, this is
hardly the Cuban missile crisis. Outside the political bubble, it
will seem remarkably minor. Yet it matters. If there are as many as
one million voters yet to choose or finally decide the referendum's
outcome, the debate winner's rhetoric and skill could have a decisive
effect.
Setting aside his stunning fall from
grace since then, think of Liberal Democrat leader Nick Clegg's
attention-griping performances in the 2010 general election debates.
In France and the US, presidential TV debates can have great
significance on popular consciousness: they can set the tone and the
morale of the campaigns.
Yet this is now turning to out to be
remarkably messy, thanks to this summer's congested events timetable,
the summer holidays and their impact on the rhythms and tempo of the
campaign. And thanks, in part, to STV.
That date is convenient for STV: the
broadcaster wants to stage the debate as part of its Scottish 500
series at the Assembly Rooms in central Edinburgh, its usual venue
for that show, with an invited audience of 500 voters.
But the Assembly Rooms is also a key
venue for the Edinburgh Fringe festival, and the 16th is
the only date it will be free until September. Any earlier, it
clashes with the World Cup which ends on 13 July. And any later in
July, and the Commonwealth Games begin in Glasgow. So STV, it seems,
has had its hand forced too.
But that date is far from convenient
for Salmond: as this blog reported last month, he and his strategists
want to stage the debates far closer to polling day – ideally just
before about one million of Scotland's 4m voters start to receive their
postal votes on 25 August, at a point when the final campaign is in full swing.
Both campaigns are planning an intense
push in mid to late August to influence and capture those postal
votes.
Go too early – in July, and the
debate will be competing for an audience already depleted by the
school holidays with the 2014 Glasgow games, the First World War
commemorations in early August and the final stages of the world cup.
Go too late, you miss influencing those
crucial postal votes – these are the committed electors who are far
more likely to take part but conversely to have made up their minds;
you may be talking to an increasingly weary and committed electorate
and you also have too little time to fix any disasters from the
debate.
And for the yes campaign, still lagging
behind in the polls, timing is critical: Salmond may be a
divisive character for many voters, but he is rightly famous for his
sharp debating skills and his ease on a stage. He is an asset which
his team needs to play very cleverly indeed.
For political anoraks, there is a more
interesting side effect of STV's gambit: they have broken free from
the broadcasting pack, and clearly shown there is no chance of the
three main broadcasters – BBC, STV and Sky – screening that
carefully choreographed sequence of set piece leaders' debates we saw
in the 2010 general election.
McDougall says that any hopes of the
three broadcasters and the two campaigns agreeing to that package
evaporated some time ago.
That may be partly Better Together's
doing: it began raising some pretty detailed requirements about the
staging and arrangements for the proposed debates at an early stage,
drawing on the expertise of some of its teams in setting up the 2010
prime ministerial debates.
The tortuous detail involved in staging
those events has left the broadcasters still carrying the “scar tissue”. They had little appetite for a repeat of that experience.