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| Version 6 | Version 7 |
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| Terror laws face Commons battle | Terror laws face Commons battle |
| (20 minutes later) | |
| The government has been warned to expect tough opposition to its plans to extend the time limit on holding terror suspects without charge. | The government has been warned to expect tough opposition to its plans to extend the time limit on holding terror suspects without charge. |
| Its Counter Terrorism Bill was given an unopposed second reading but Lib Dems, Tories and some Labour MPs say they will fight parts of it later on. | |
| Home Secretary Jacqui Smith insisted she wanted a "reserve power" not a permanent extension from 28 to 42 days. | Home Secretary Jacqui Smith insisted she wanted a "reserve power" not a permanent extension from 28 to 42 days. |
| But Chris Huhne said the Lib Dems would fight the proposal "tooth and nail". | But Chris Huhne said the Lib Dems would fight the proposal "tooth and nail". |
| The bill passed its first Parliamentary hurdle earlier when MPs gave it an unopposed second reading - now it goes to committee stage where MPs will scrutinise the detail. | |
| Opening the debate Ms Smith said the proposal on pre-charge detention was a "wholly different model" to the planned 90-day limit that was defeated in the Commons in 2005. | Opening the debate Ms Smith said the proposal on pre-charge detention was a "wholly different model" to the planned 90-day limit that was defeated in the Commons in 2005. |
| She said the terrorist threat was of an "unprecedented scale" and the sheer weight and amount of material that had to be gone through - often of an international nature - presented a new challenge to investigators. | She said the terrorist threat was of an "unprecedented scale" and the sheer weight and amount of material that had to be gone through - often of an international nature - presented a new challenge to investigators. |
| 'Clear need' | 'Clear need' |
| "As the threat from terrorism evolves, so our laws must adapt to remain effective," she said. | "As the threat from terrorism evolves, so our laws must adapt to remain effective," she said. |
| She said the government had moved a "considerable way" from the original 90-days option. | She said the government had moved a "considerable way" from the original 90-days option. |
| There is no proposal for a blanket extension to 42 days - that is a myth and that is wrong Gordon Brown | There is no proposal for a blanket extension to 42 days - that is a myth and that is wrong Gordon Brown |
| Ms Smith said: "We are not now proposing a permanent, automatic or immediate extension to pre-charge detention beyond the current maximum limit of 28 days. | Ms Smith said: "We are not now proposing a permanent, automatic or immediate extension to pre-charge detention beyond the current maximum limit of 28 days. |
| "We are proposing a reserve power - not to be used lightly - that would mean that a higher limit could only become available if there was a clear and exceptional operational need, supported by the police and the CPS, and approved by the home secretary." | "We are proposing a reserve power - not to be used lightly - that would mean that a higher limit could only become available if there was a clear and exceptional operational need, supported by the police and the CPS, and approved by the home secretary." |
| She said it would be subject to Parliamentary approval within 30 days, a senior judge would decide whether someone was held - and she pledged to continue a "consensus building approach" as the Bill continues its Parliamentary progress. | She said it would be subject to Parliamentary approval within 30 days, a senior judge would decide whether someone was held - and she pledged to continue a "consensus building approach" as the Bill continues its Parliamentary progress. |
| 'No evidence' | 'No evidence' |
| But some Labour backbenchers remain unconvinced by the arguments - and are expected to vote against the Counter-Terrorism Bill during the later stages of its passage through Parliament. | But some Labour backbenchers remain unconvinced by the arguments - and are expected to vote against the Counter-Terrorism Bill during the later stages of its passage through Parliament. |
| We on these benches will fight tooth and nail against these provisions which we believe to prove to be a serious erosion of hard-won freedoms Chris HuhneLiberal Democrats | We on these benches will fight tooth and nail against these provisions which we believe to prove to be a serious erosion of hard-won freedoms Chris HuhneLiberal Democrats |
| Labour's Bob Marshall-Andrews, a QC, said the government had produced "simply no evidence whatsoever" to back the Bill. | Labour's Bob Marshall-Andrews, a QC, said the government had produced "simply no evidence whatsoever" to back the Bill. |
| For the Conservatives, David Davis also told MPs: "There is not one shred of evidence for extension beyond 28 days - full stop." | For the Conservatives, David Davis also told MPs: "There is not one shred of evidence for extension beyond 28 days - full stop." |
| While he said ministers conjured up "nightmare scenarios" - but there was already a solution, to use the Civil Contingencies Act. | While he said ministers conjured up "nightmare scenarios" - but there was already a solution, to use the Civil Contingencies Act. |
| And he said while the Conservatives would support parts of the Bill - such as allowing post-charge questioning - extending the pre-charge detention period up to 42 days could act as a "recruiting sergeant" for terrorists. | And he said while the Conservatives would support parts of the Bill - such as allowing post-charge questioning - extending the pre-charge detention period up to 42 days could act as a "recruiting sergeant" for terrorists. |
| Police support | Police support |
| For the Liberal Democrats, Chris Huhne said aspects of the Bill were deeply intrusive to "hard won civil liberties". | For the Liberal Democrats, Chris Huhne said aspects of the Bill were deeply intrusive to "hard won civil liberties". |
| He praised proposals such as the limited use of intercept evidence but attacked the proposal to allow pre-charge detention to be extended. | He praised proposals such as the limited use of intercept evidence but attacked the proposal to allow pre-charge detention to be extended. |
| "We on these benches will fight tooth and nail against these provisions which we believe to prove to be a serious erosion of hard-won freedoms, just as crucially it will prove to be counter productive," he said. | "We on these benches will fight tooth and nail against these provisions which we believe to prove to be a serious erosion of hard-won freedoms, just as crucially it will prove to be counter productive," he said. |
| But Labour former minister Frank Field criticised MPs who wanted to "remain passive and see what the terrorists inflict on us and then react accordingly". | But Labour former minister Frank Field criticised MPs who wanted to "remain passive and see what the terrorists inflict on us and then react accordingly". |
| Earlier Prime Minister Gordon Brown said: "There is no proposal for a blanket extension to 42 days. That is a myth and that is wrong." | Earlier Prime Minister Gordon Brown said: "There is no proposal for a blanket extension to 42 days. That is a myth and that is wrong." |
| The proposals are supported by some senior police officers - but could face a court challenge from the Equality and Human Rights Commission if passed. | The proposals are supported by some senior police officers - but could face a court challenge from the Equality and Human Rights Commission if passed. |