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You can find the current article at its original source at https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2016/jun/15/eu-referendum-live-osborne-punishment-budget-farage-flotilla-thames
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| EU referendum: Michael Gove on BBC's Question Time EU Special - live | EU referendum: Michael Gove on BBC's Question Time EU Special - live |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| 8.01pm BST | |
| 20:01 | |
| Gove on the Guardian | |
| Here is the key quote from Michael Gove about the Guardian’s story about his father contradicting claims made by Gove himself about the family’s fish processing firm in Aberdeen being destroyed by the European Union’s fisheries policies. Gove told Question Time: | |
| My dad was rung up by a reporter from the Guardian who tried to put words into his mouth but my dad has been clear, he was clear to the BBC on Sunday night, he was clear to me when I was a boy, that the business that he invested so much care and time in had to close as a result of the common fisheries policy. | |
| I remember when my dad ran his business. Two of his employees were lads who were in a care home. They did not have parents. My dad took them in, gave them a job and allowed them to work in his business and to sleep there in a spare room that he made for them. That business closed. Those boys lost their home as a result of what happened. I know what my dad went through when I was a schoolboy and I don’t think that the Guardian or anyone else should belittle his suffering or try to get a 79--year-old man to serve their agenda instead of agreeing and being proud of what his son does. | |
| Updated | |
| at 8.07pm BST | |
| 7.51pm BST | |
| 19:51 | |
| Gove on Question Time - Snap verdict | |
| Gove on Question Time - Snap verdict: Michael Gove’s appearance on Sky News’s EU referendum special two weeks ago was generally viewed as a success. Personally I felt that his failure to answer key economic questions was a fatal handicap, but generally commentators felt he came across as measured, likeable and persuasive. | |
| Tonight did not go quite so smoothly. It did not go badly either, but Gove sounded just a little more edgy and thin-skinned, and at times some of his answers sounded glib. Question Time with David Dimbleby is in a league of its own when it comes to getting members of a studio audience to interrogate politicians in a forensic way, and not just a shouty way, and Gove had several exchanges with people where his answers clearly fell short (eg the woman with the translation business). It was also interesting to note that immigration, which is normally an easy subject for leave, was quite tricky for him tonight, with Dimbleby highlighting the government’s failure to use its powers to curb non-EU migration and a Spanish woman trying to make Gove ashamed of his stance. | |
| The highlight, though, was Gove’s attack on the Guardian. All of us can understand the desire to protect one’s parents and no doubt many people watching will sympathise with what he said. We will be publishing more on this soon. But as far as I’m aware at no point has Gove, or anyone else, challenged the accuracy of a single word attributed to Gove’s father in Severin Carrell’s story. I’ve worked with Severin on and off for about 20 years and he is one of the most scrupulous and accurate reporters I know. Obviously you would expect me to say that. You’ll have to read his story and Gove’s remarks (which I will post shortly) and decide for yourself who you trust. | |
| Updated | |
| at 8.00pm BST | |
| 7.32pm BST | 7.32pm BST |
| 19:32 | 19:32 |
| Q: Do you regret using the £350m a week figure for the amount the EU costs the UK? | Q: Do you regret using the £350m a week figure for the amount the EU costs the UK? |
| Gove says some people have criticised. He says that is the amount of money the EU controls. Some of it comes back. But the rebate has been cut in the past, and it will be cut in the future again if we stay in. | |
| Q: You sound plausible, but I can’t help thinking you are a wolf in sheep’s clothing. (She is using a phrase Jeremy Corbyn used yesterday.) | Q: You sound plausible, but I can’t help thinking you are a wolf in sheep’s clothing. (She is using a phrase Jeremy Corbyn used yesterday.) |
| Gove says Britain will be stronger, freer and fairer outside the EU. | |
| And that’s it. | And that’s it. |
| I will post a verdict and a summary soon. | I will post a verdict and a summary soon. |
| Updated | |
| at 7.45pm BST | |
| 7.26pm BST | 7.26pm BST |
| 19:26 | 19:26 |
| Gove says he does not favour deporting anyone who is hard working. | Gove says he does not favour deporting anyone who is hard working. |
| But he says a Bank of England report showed wages were being held down by immigration. It is not right to set community against community, he says. | But he says a Bank of England report showed wages were being held down by immigration. It is not right to set community against community, he says. |
| He says he objects to the way a member of the audience is talking down people in this country. | He says he objects to the way a member of the audience is talking down people in this country. |
| 7.24pm BST | 7.24pm BST |
| 19:24 | 19:24 |
| A member of the audience complains about how immigrants like her are treated in this country. “We are not the enemy, Mr Gove,” she says. | A member of the audience complains about how immigrants like her are treated in this country. “We are not the enemy, Mr Gove,” she says. |
| Gove says he understands the woman’s point of view. He is in favour of migration, he says. He just wants to control the numbers. | |
| The woman says she does not believe him. | The woman says she does not believe him. |
| Updated | |
| at 7.45pm BST | |
| 7.21pm BST | 7.21pm BST |
| 19:21 | 19:21 |
| Gove suggests immigration would not be reduced until after 2020 if we left the EU | Gove suggests immigration would not be reduced until after 2020 if we left the EU |
| Gove says he thinks we can secure exit from the EU by 2020. | Gove says he thinks we can secure exit from the EU by 2020. |
| And we can get immigration down in the next parliament. | And we can get immigration down in the next parliament. |
| Q: But the government can control immigration from outside the EU, and those numbers are still well over 100,000. | Q: But the government can control immigration from outside the EU, and those numbers are still well over 100,000. |
| Gove says that is within our control. If we leave the EU, we cannot place any limits on migration from within the EU. | Gove says that is within our control. If we leave the EU, we cannot place any limits on migration from within the EU. |
| 7.19pm BST | 7.19pm BST |
| 19:19 | 19:19 |
| Gove says under EU law there are criminals here we cannot deport. If we leave the EU, we can have an Australian-style points system. | Gove says under EU law there are criminals here we cannot deport. If we leave the EU, we can have an Australian-style points system. |
| 7.18pm BST | 7.18pm BST |
| 19:18 | 19:18 |
| Q: Are you scaremongering when you say Turkey will join the EU? | Q: Are you scaremongering when you say Turkey will join the EU? |
| Absolutely not, says Gove. He says the Financial Times has a story today saying moves to get Turkey into the EU are being accelerated. | Absolutely not, says Gove. He says the Financial Times has a story today saying moves to get Turkey into the EU are being accelerated. |
| Q: Cameron says we have a veto on Turkey joining the EU? | Q: Cameron says we have a veto on Turkey joining the EU? |
| Gove says that is correct. But it is official government policy for Turkey to join. The government has no intention of using that veto. | Gove says that is correct. But it is official government policy for Turkey to join. The government has no intention of using that veto. |
| He says he thinks Turkey joining the EU will “’inevitably” happen in our lifetime unless we vote to leave. | He says he thinks Turkey joining the EU will “’inevitably” happen in our lifetime unless we vote to leave. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.22pm BST | at 7.22pm BST |
| 7.15pm BST | 7.15pm BST |
| 19:15 | 19:15 |
| Q: If we get a leave vote, are you confident a prime minister who campaigned for remain will deliver what the country wants? | Q: If we get a leave vote, are you confident a prime minister who campaigned for remain will deliver what the country wants? |
| Gove says the referendum is about giving instructions to the prime minister. David Cameron has promised he will abide by the decision of the people. | Gove says the referendum is about giving instructions to the prime minister. David Cameron has promised he will abide by the decision of the people. |
| Q: And what will happen to George Osborne. Some 65 Tory MPs say they will not vote for his budget. Will he have to go? | Q: And what will happen to George Osborne. Some 65 Tory MPs say they will not vote for his budget. Will he have to go? |
| Gove says the remain campaign have been “ramping up the fear, turning it up to 11”. Do you want the UK to govern itself? Or do you want it run by the EU and its five presidents, none of whom you can name? | Gove says the remain campaign have been “ramping up the fear, turning it up to 11”. Do you want the UK to govern itself? Or do you want it run by the EU and its five presidents, none of whom you can name? |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.24pm BST | at 7.24pm BST |
| 7.11pm BST | 7.11pm BST |
| 19:11 | 19:11 |
| Gove attacks the Guardian for its report saying EU not to blame for his father's business going bust | Gove attacks the Guardian for its report saying EU not to blame for his father's business going bust |
| Q: I study English literature, and the manipulation of words. All I’ve heard from you is manipulation. | Q: I study English literature, and the manipulation of words. All I’ve heard from you is manipulation. |
| Gove says he read English too. Vote Leave has put forward a plan today for what would happen. He says he was able to go to university because of his family’s sacrifices. He says his father lost his fishing business because of EU policies. The EU is a job-destroying machine. That is a tragedy. | Gove says he read English too. Vote Leave has put forward a plan today for what would happen. He says he was able to go to university because of his family’s sacrifices. He says his father lost his fishing business because of EU policies. The EU is a job-destroying machine. That is a tragedy. |
| Q: Today your father is quoted as saying it was not the EU that made him close his business. | Q: Today your father is quoted as saying it was not the EU that made him close his business. |
| Gove says his father was rung up by a Guardian journalist “who tried to put words in his mouth”. He says he remembers what happened. He says two workers lost their homes. The Guardian should not be using a 79-year-old man to suit their agenda, and it should not be belittling what he did. | Gove says his father was rung up by a Guardian journalist “who tried to put words in his mouth”. He says he remembers what happened. He says two workers lost their homes. The Guardian should not be using a 79-year-old man to suit their agenda, and it should not be belittling what he did. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.15pm BST | at 7.15pm BST |
| 7.06pm BST | 7.06pm BST |
| 19:06 | 19:06 |
| Q: I run a small business and more than 50% of my trade is with the EU. How can you guarantee that I won’t lose out? | Q: I run a small business and more than 50% of my trade is with the EU. How can you guarantee that I won’t lose out? |
| Gove says there will be no reason to think they will impose tariffs. It will be in their interests not to impose tariffs. | Gove says there will be no reason to think they will impose tariffs. It will be in their interests not to impose tariffs. |
| Q: But I sell to them. I have a translation business. It is much more difficult to work with non-EU countries. And if we become a non-EU country, it will be harder for me. | Q: But I sell to them. I have a translation business. It is much more difficult to work with non-EU countries. And if we become a non-EU country, it will be harder for me. |
| Gove says that will only be the case if EU countries take leave of their senses. It is in the interests of both sides to keep tariffs down. | Gove says that will only be the case if EU countries take leave of their senses. It is in the interests of both sides to keep tariffs down. |
| Q: But you tell us the EU does take leave of its senses. You quoted Donald Tusk. | Q: But you tell us the EU does take leave of its senses. You quoted Donald Tusk. |
| Gove says they are trying to scare us into staying, because we pay many of the bills. | Gove says they are trying to scare us into staying, because we pay many of the bills. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.13pm BST | at 7.13pm BST |
| 7.03pm BST | 7.03pm BST |
| 19:03 | 19:03 |
| Q: As a physicist I am terrified what will happen to British science if we succeed. What will we do when our funding dries up? | Q: As a physicist I am terrified what will happen to British science if we succeed. What will we do when our funding dries up? |
| Gove says some physicists think we will be better off outside the EU. And all the EU money going to universities is our money in the first place. | Gove says some physicists think we will be better off outside the EU. And all the EU money going to universities is our money in the first place. |
| He says he does not believe in the scare stories. Donald Tusk says Brexit will lead to the end of Western civilisation. | He says he does not believe in the scare stories. Donald Tusk says Brexit will lead to the end of Western civilisation. |
| Q: But we get more money out of the EU for science than we put in. | Q: But we get more money out of the EU for science than we put in. |
| Gove says that is not true. Overall we hand over £20bn to the EU. | Gove says that is not true. Overall we hand over £20bn to the EU. |
| Q: But for science we get more than we put in. The IOP [Institute of Physics] has said that, the Royal Society has said that. | Q: But for science we get more than we put in. The IOP [Institute of Physics] has said that, the Royal Society has said that. |
| Gove says we hand over £20bn, and get £10bn back. | Gove says we hand over £20bn, and get £10bn back. |
| 7.00pm BST | 7.00pm BST |
| 19:00 | 19:00 |
| Q: The risks are economic. What trading relationship will we have? You want us to lose autonomy, and lose influence over decision making. You are off your rocker if you think we are better off. | Q: The risks are economic. What trading relationship will we have? You want us to lose autonomy, and lose influence over decision making. You are off your rocker if you think we are better off. |
| Gove says the Germans sell more cars to us than we sell to them. Germany won’t punish its car workers. | Gove says the Germans sell more cars to us than we sell to them. Germany won’t punish its car workers. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.03pm BST | at 7.03pm BST |
| 6.57pm BST | 6.57pm BST |
| 18:57 | 18:57 |
| Q: Everything in life has risks. What are the risks of leaving? | Q: Everything in life has risks. What are the risks of leaving? |
| Gove says the questioner is right. But he thinks we will be better off out. Yes, there will be bumps in the road ... | Gove says the questioner is right. But he thinks we will be better off out. Yes, there will be bumps in the road ... |
| Q: What will they be? | Q: What will they be? |
| Gove says there will be risks if we leave or stay. | Gove says there will be risks if we leave or stay. |
| Q: Are you saying there are now downsides from leaving. | Q: Are you saying there are now downsides from leaving. |
| Gove says the UK will be in a stronger position if we leave. It won’t be milk and honey. But the British people will be liberated to deal with any risks they encounter. | Gove says the UK will be in a stronger position if we leave. It won’t be milk and honey. But the British people will be liberated to deal with any risks they encounter. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 7.03pm BST | at 7.03pm BST |
| 6.55pm BST | 6.55pm BST |
| 18:55 | 18:55 |
| Q: If you value the NHS so much, where was your support for junior doctors? | Q: If you value the NHS so much, where was your support for junior doctors? |
| Gove says the NHS will be stronger if we leave. It will have more money, and be under less strain. | Gove says the NHS will be stronger if we leave. It will have more money, and be under less strain. |
| 6.54pm BST | 6.54pm BST |
| 18:54 | 18:54 |
| Q: Why are you dismissing the views of economic experts? | Q: Why are you dismissing the views of economic experts? |
| Gove says they were wrong about the euro and the ERM. | Gove says they were wrong about the euro and the ERM. |
| Q: But the IFS did not support the euro. | Q: But the IFS did not support the euro. |
| Gove says he wants the UK to take back control of its affairs. | Gove says he wants the UK to take back control of its affairs. |
| Q: How can we trust you when you co-authored a book saying we should dismantle the NHS? | Q: How can we trust you when you co-authored a book saying we should dismantle the NHS? |
| Gove says he supports the NHS. He says leaving would allow us to give it an extra £100m a week. | Gove says he supports the NHS. He says leaving would allow us to give it an extra £100m a week. |
| Q: But John Major said you want to privatise it. | Q: But John Major said you want to privatise it. |
| Gove says he cherishes it. | Gove says he cherishes it. |
| Q: But 10 years ago you wanted to privatise it. You have changed your mind. | Q: But 10 years ago you wanted to privatise it. You have changed your mind. |
| Gove says the book was written by a group of people. He did not write anything in it about the NHS. His commitment to the NHS is absolute. | Gove says the book was written by a group of people. He did not write anything in it about the NHS. His commitment to the NHS is absolute. |
| He wants the money to be spent by us, on our priorities. He does not know of a higher priority to the British public. | He wants the money to be spent by us, on our priorities. He does not know of a higher priority to the British public. |
| 6.50pm BST | 6.50pm BST |
| 18:50 | 18:50 |
| Q: If we vote to leave the EU, will you support George Osborne’s punishment budget? | Q: If we vote to leave the EU, will you support George Osborne’s punishment budget? |
| No, says Michael Gove. | No, says Michael Gove. |
| He says all we have heard from remain have been dire warnings. | He says all we have heard from remain have been dire warnings. |
| But the economy will do well, he says. Leaving would be a “win, win” for the economy. The EU has the lowest growth of any continent apart from Antarctica. | But the economy will do well, he says. Leaving would be a “win, win” for the economy. The EU has the lowest growth of any continent apart from Antarctica. |
| Q: George Osborne was talking about IFS figures. You respect the IFS. | Q: George Osborne was talking about IFS figures. You respect the IFS. |
| Gove says the IFS did not say there would be a £30bn hole in the budget immediately after we left. Stuart Rose, who leads the in campaign, has said nothing would change if we left, he says. | Gove says the IFS did not say there would be a £30bn hole in the budget immediately after we left. Stuart Rose, who leads the in campaign, has said nothing would change if we left, he says. |
| Gove says “it’s a shame” the remain camp are talking this country down – with some anger in his voice. | Gove says “it’s a shame” the remain camp are talking this country down – with some anger in his voice. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 6.57pm BST | at 6.57pm BST |
| 6.46pm BST | 6.46pm BST |
| 18:46 | 18:46 |
| Question Time EU Special | Question Time EU Special |
| David Dimbleby is introducing the programme. | David Dimbleby is introducing the programme. |
| They are recording from Nottingham. | They are recording from Nottingham. |
| 6.44pm BST | 6.44pm BST |
| 18:44 | 18:44 |
| Tonight’s Question Time is going out live. Normally it records an hour or so before transmission. | Tonight’s Question Time is going out live. Normally it records an hour or so before transmission. |