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You can find the current article at its original source at https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2017/oct/18/energy-battle-turns-to-the-states-as-the-sell-heats-up-politics-live
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| Version 1 | Version 2 |
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| Energy battle turns to the states, as the sell heats up – politics live | Energy battle turns to the states, as the sell heats up – politics live |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| 11.31pm BST | |
| 23:31 | |
| The bells are ringing, signalling parliament is about to officially begin for the day. | |
| The House schedule can be found here. | |
| While the Senate one can be found here. | |
| Updated | |
| at 11.37pm BST | |
| 11.28pm BST | |
| 23:28 | |
| Looking outside of energy for a moment, the Senate has the government’s welfare reforms listed for debate today – they would be the ones that introduce the drug-testing trials. | |
| It is safe to say that the current UN special rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, Prof Philip Alston, is not a fan of the policy. | |
| The Australian government is conflating social protection and drug enforcement policies in a way that is counter-productive, unless the main goal is to stigmatise social security recipients. If the real goal is to reduce the use of illegal drugs, why start with the poorest members of society? Will there also be a policy designed to drug test and crack down on the well-to-do who spend far more on drugs, and receive all sorts of tax deductions, social security payments and other government benefits? Or is it only the poorest whose drug use the government feels it should punish through social security-based measures? | |
| Paul Karp will have a full report on that for you, soon. | |
| Updated | |
| at 11.38pm BST | |
| 11.12pm BST | |
| 23:12 | |
| As predicted, Labor has honed in on the “affordability” aspect of the national energy guarantee. | |
| Tanya Plibersek told Sky Labor would take a look at the policy but added: | |
| What kind of government proposes something as big and serious as this without doing any modelling and without doing a regulatory impact statement? I think it is a shambles and it is driven by their internal problems. I think they wanted to announce this much later this year but Tony Abbott has put pressure on them with his outbursts in public and so they’ve gone too soon without any modelling or regulatory impact statement. | |
| Same Dastyari meanwhile took the opportunity to launch his latest Senate doors (where the media waits to question arriving politicians) stunt, showing up with some melted soft serve and cheeseburgers. | |
| “These are soft-serve savings,” he said. “You think it is a good idea at the start. It goes flaccid quickly and afterwards you wonder what all the fuss is about.” | |
| Updated | |
| at 11.15pm BST | |
| 10.56pm BST | 10.56pm BST |
| 22:56 | 22:56 |
| Has anyone looked up defensive in the dictionary lately? | Has anyone looked up defensive in the dictionary lately? |
| Here is a snippet of the AM interview between Sabra Lane and Malcolm Turnbull this morning. | Here is a snippet of the AM interview between Sabra Lane and Malcolm Turnbull this morning. |
| Lane: You are guaranteeing that they are the best informed but you are still not guaranteeing those figures. | Lane: You are guaranteeing that they are the best informed but you are still not guaranteeing those figures. |
| Turnbull: Sabra, what I am guaranteeing is that we are taking advice from the best people in the field and that is unquestionably the Energy Security Board. Coag, the Labor premiers ... | |
| Lane: We will get to a board in just a tick. | Lane: We will get to a board in just a tick. |
| Turnbull: No, no, | Turnbull: No, no, |
| Lane: I’m sorry ... prime minister ... | |
| Turnbull: What are you apologising for? | Turnbull: What are you apologising for? |
| Lane: I am sorry to interrupt you. The Coalition has made affordability an issue. | Lane: I am sorry to interrupt you. The Coalition has made affordability an issue. |
| Turnbull: Yes. | Turnbull: Yes. |
| Lane: There is no modelling to back the figures up. | Lane: There is no modelling to back the figures up. |
| Turnbull: They come from the Energy Security Board. | Turnbull: They come from the Energy Security Board. |
| Lane: The board is made up of the regulator and the commission bodies that oversaw the last 10 years of disastrous policy in this country. | Lane: The board is made up of the regulator and the commission bodies that oversaw the last 10 years of disastrous policy in this country. |
| Turnbull: There is nobody better qualified to talk about the way the market operates and how we can best ensure reliability. The energy market operator is headed by Audrey Zibelman, who did a similar job in New York before she came out to Australia. She is, as she said yesterday, regularly intervening in the South Australian market to keep the lights on because of the failure of politics in South Australia and the introduction of a massive amount of wind energy in that state without the back-up or the security to ensure system reliability. So, Sabra, you can, if you wish, disrespect these distinguished and expert Australians. I don’t. I’m taking their advice and I just want to remind you that that Energy Security Board was established by Coag. There were more Labor party governments supporting the establishment of the Energy Security Board and they will give the same advice to the Coag governments as they have given to us. All I’m saying, my only request, is that their advice is considered very carefully and respectfully and, I mean, I was surprised to hear your attack on those distinguished Australians. I think you should – I think we owe them the respect that their credibility and expertise deserves. You know what we really owe is a duty to your listeners to get their power bills down and that’s why we’re taking the right advice. We are going to establish a level playing field so that technologies can compete because we owe it to Australians to take the politics and the name calling and the disrespect out of this debate, focus on the engineering and the economics. That’s what the Energy Security Board has done and that is the duty I owe to your listeners and all Australians. | |
| Updated | |
| at 11.20pm BST | |
| 10.35pm BST | 10.35pm BST |
| 22:35 | 22:35 |
| Side note – so far, well, at least as far as I can tell, government ministers have avoided calling it the Neg. It’s “the policy” or “what we are doing”. Take from that what you will. | |
| Updated | |
| at 11.21pm BST | |
| 10.34pm BST | 10.34pm BST |
| 22:34 | 22:34 |
| The treasurer, Scott Morrison, has also been sent out on the front lines and he’s been just as defensive as you would expect. Asked about the saving figures, which work out, best-case scenario, to about $2 a week (sometime between 2020-2030) he told the ABC the Neg needed to be considered with all the other changes the government has made. | The treasurer, Scott Morrison, has also been sent out on the front lines and he’s been just as defensive as you would expect. Asked about the saving figures, which work out, best-case scenario, to about $2 a week (sometime between 2020-2030) he told the ABC the Neg needed to be considered with all the other changes the government has made. |
| “This is not the only thing the government is doing. This increases certainty. In addition to that, we’ve got the initiatives on gas, to secure gas for Australian domestic demand, the work we’ve done with the retailers, the work we’ve done on reforming the regulation. All of this means people are getting discounts now that they wouldn’t have got a year ago, two years ago because of the work the government is doing. On top of that, always a relative choice. People will always pick what the Labor party is saying which has a 45% emissions reduction target and which would require $66bn worth of subsidies that you don’t need to pay to meet our environmental obligations that we’ve set out at 26% ... There is a great light that has been shone on this. Australians have a clear choice: they can pay more for electricity under Bill Shorten or they can have lower prices under Malcolm Turnbull and the investment certainty that goes with it, that meets the environmental obligations. It’s a clear choice. | “This is not the only thing the government is doing. This increases certainty. In addition to that, we’ve got the initiatives on gas, to secure gas for Australian domestic demand, the work we’ve done with the retailers, the work we’ve done on reforming the regulation. All of this means people are getting discounts now that they wouldn’t have got a year ago, two years ago because of the work the government is doing. On top of that, always a relative choice. People will always pick what the Labor party is saying which has a 45% emissions reduction target and which would require $66bn worth of subsidies that you don’t need to pay to meet our environmental obligations that we’ve set out at 26% ... There is a great light that has been shone on this. Australians have a clear choice: they can pay more for electricity under Bill Shorten or they can have lower prices under Malcolm Turnbull and the investment certainty that goes with it, that meets the environmental obligations. It’s a clear choice. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.53pm BST | at 10.53pm BST |
| 10.28pm BST | 10.28pm BST |
| 22:28 | 22:28 |
| To a sleeper issue now, but one which is annoying a lot *buffering* of, of, of *buffering* people. | To a sleeper issue now, but one which is annoying a lot *buffering* of, of, of *buffering* people. |
| The telecommunications industry ombudsman has released the latest complaint figures for 2016-17, which Labor’s communications spokeswoman, Michelle Rowland, described as a “damming indictment” of the government’s roll out of the NBN. | The telecommunications industry ombudsman has released the latest complaint figures for 2016-17, which Labor’s communications spokeswoman, Michelle Rowland, described as a “damming indictment” of the government’s roll out of the NBN. |
| “The TIO reports that NBN complaints in 2016-17 surged by 159% when compared to the previous period,” she said in a statement. “Of significant concern, NBN complaints are growing 37% faster than the number of new NBN services being activated – a pattern not observed in any of the previous years. | “The TIO reports that NBN complaints in 2016-17 surged by 159% when compared to the previous period,” she said in a statement. “Of significant concern, NBN complaints are growing 37% faster than the number of new NBN services being activated – a pattern not observed in any of the previous years. |
| “And, for the first time, internet services are the highest source of complaints to the TIO.” | “And, for the first time, internet services are the highest source of complaints to the TIO.” |
| Malcolm Turnbull is one of the staunchest defenders of the program, having overseen it while communications minister. He has repeatedly said that, given the scale of the roll out (it reached 6 million premises in August), there are going to be some bumps but he is watching it. | Malcolm Turnbull is one of the staunchest defenders of the program, having overseen it while communications minister. He has repeatedly said that, given the scale of the roll out (it reached 6 million premises in August), there are going to be some bumps but he is watching it. |
| Here is what he told Today: | Here is what he told Today: |
| Just a fact of life, it is a bit like television. If you’ve got hardly any viewers, you won’t get a lot of complaints. With NBN, what we have now got, it is true. What we have now got is about 3 million people are actively connected on to the network. We are connecting more people every 10 days than Labor did in six years. So you get a lot more customers, they are rolling on and around 30,000, 40,000 a week. Clearly you are going to get more complaints but you know what? We aim to have 100% satisfaction. Can’t be achieved, I know that, but the goal is to ensure that the installation experience is a good one and obviously that people are satisfied with the service when they get it. | Just a fact of life, it is a bit like television. If you’ve got hardly any viewers, you won’t get a lot of complaints. With NBN, what we have now got, it is true. What we have now got is about 3 million people are actively connected on to the network. We are connecting more people every 10 days than Labor did in six years. So you get a lot more customers, they are rolling on and around 30,000, 40,000 a week. Clearly you are going to get more complaints but you know what? We aim to have 100% satisfaction. Can’t be achieved, I know that, but the goal is to ensure that the installation experience is a good one and obviously that people are satisfied with the service when they get it. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.51pm BST | at 10.51pm BST |
| 10.21pm BST | 10.21pm BST |
| 22:21 | 22:21 |
| The prime minister is also facing residual questions over Tony Abbott’s reluctance to accept the policy. | The prime minister is also facing residual questions over Tony Abbott’s reluctance to accept the policy. |
| Here was his response to that on Sunrise: | Here was his response to that on Sunrise: |
| We didn’t adopt the clean energy target. If we wanted to, we would have. We had reservations about it and what we have now is a recommendation from the energy security board which consists of the leaders of our energy market regulators and operators, the smartest people in the room, these other experts that everyone is telling us to listen to, this is where you find the engineering and the economics that is the guide to my government’s energy policy. The day of slogans, ideology and politics, we should put it behind us ... Industry has recognised on a truly rational and objective approach, a level playing field backed by engineering and economics. | We didn’t adopt the clean energy target. If we wanted to, we would have. We had reservations about it and what we have now is a recommendation from the energy security board which consists of the leaders of our energy market regulators and operators, the smartest people in the room, these other experts that everyone is telling us to listen to, this is where you find the engineering and the economics that is the guide to my government’s energy policy. The day of slogans, ideology and politics, we should put it behind us ... Industry has recognised on a truly rational and objective approach, a level playing field backed by engineering and economics. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.42pm BST | at 10.42pm BST |
| 10.18pm BST | 10.18pm BST |
| 22:18 | 22:18 |
| Malcolm Turnbull is talking to Sabra Lane on ABC and is getting very defensive over the average saving figure and whether the government can guarantee it. The short version is, it can’t. But he has turned any questioning of that figure into an attack on the experts on the energy security board. That started yesterday, when Turnbull attacked Bill Shorten for “disrespecting” those on the board, when the figure was queried. | Malcolm Turnbull is talking to Sabra Lane on ABC and is getting very defensive over the average saving figure and whether the government can guarantee it. The short version is, it can’t. But he has turned any questioning of that figure into an attack on the experts on the energy security board. That started yesterday, when Turnbull attacked Bill Shorten for “disrespecting” those on the board, when the figure was queried. |
| All we have here is a calculation from the ESB. It has promised to do more modelling before Coag but, at the moment, the government can only point to a few lines. It says that should be enough. But given the amount of attention the government has focused on the affordability aspect during the power wars, it is not something that is going to go away anytime soon. | All we have here is a calculation from the ESB. It has promised to do more modelling before Coag but, at the moment, the government can only point to a few lines. It says that should be enough. But given the amount of attention the government has focused on the affordability aspect during the power wars, it is not something that is going to go away anytime soon. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.41pm BST | at 10.41pm BST |
| 10.10pm BST | 10.10pm BST |
| 22:10 | 22:10 |
| Paul Karp | Paul Karp |
| The energy and environment minister, Josh Frydenberg, has attacked the states for expressing criticism of the national energy guarantee. | The energy and environment minister, Josh Frydenberg, has attacked the states for expressing criticism of the national energy guarantee. |
| “It’s bizarre for them to be openly critical when they don’t have the detail,” he told Radio National. | “It’s bizarre for them to be openly critical when they don’t have the detail,” he told Radio National. |
| Frydenberg cited endorsements of the Neg from the Grattan Institute, AGL, Energy Australia, the Australian Industry Group and BlueScope. | Frydenberg cited endorsements of the Neg from the Grattan Institute, AGL, Energy Australia, the Australian Industry Group and BlueScope. |
| Asked if the Neg essentially sets an emissions intensity baseline that in effect mandates renewable energy, Frydenberg said renewables “will be absolutely critical” and electricity generators will need “a mix of assets”, including thermal generation and renewables. | Asked if the Neg essentially sets an emissions intensity baseline that in effect mandates renewable energy, Frydenberg said renewables “will be absolutely critical” and electricity generators will need “a mix of assets”, including thermal generation and renewables. |
| “The question is: what is the lowest cost to the consumer? With technology costs coming down quite dramatically the ability to back-end [emissions reduction] is there. [The Paris agreement target] is very important to meet.” | “The question is: what is the lowest cost to the consumer? With technology costs coming down quite dramatically the ability to back-end [emissions reduction] is there. [The Paris agreement target] is very important to meet.” |
| Frydenberg noted that electricity suppliers can use “the existing contract market to source the right amount of generation” to meet the twin objectives of emissions reduction and reliability. | Frydenberg noted that electricity suppliers can use “the existing contract market to source the right amount of generation” to meet the twin objectives of emissions reduction and reliability. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.40pm BST | at 10.40pm BST |
| 10.09pm BST | 10.09pm BST |
| 22:09 | 22:09 |
| Good morning and welcome to the hard energy sell | Good morning and welcome to the hard energy sell |
| The Neg is alive and the government has embarked on a sell that could teach Hollywood studio bosses a thing or two. | The Neg is alive and the government has embarked on a sell that could teach Hollywood studio bosses a thing or two. |
| The energy minister, Josh Frydenberg, was up before the sun hitting the airwaves with his brief of “affordability, reliability and responsibility”, the message having been slightly tweaked overnight to acknowledge the environment. | The energy minister, Josh Frydenberg, was up before the sun hitting the airwaves with his brief of “affordability, reliability and responsibility”, the message having been slightly tweaked overnight to acknowledge the environment. |
| Malcolm Turnbull has also been beaming across commercial TV screens on the big sell but, having convinced the party room (with a few notable exceptions, Tony Abbott included), it is on to the states. | Malcolm Turnbull has also been beaming across commercial TV screens on the big sell but, having convinced the party room (with a few notable exceptions, Tony Abbott included), it is on to the states. |
| The government wants Coag to agree to this but the Labor-led states may be a problem. Speaking to Sunrise, Turnbull said this is what the states wanted, so they should get with the program. | The government wants Coag to agree to this but the Labor-led states may be a problem. Speaking to Sunrise, Turnbull said this is what the states wanted, so they should get with the program. |
| What I am saying to everyone and to the premiers who sit around the table at our meetings; you appointed the energy security board. You appointed them as they are smart and you wanted that advice. They have given us the advice, why don’t we listen to it and follow it? Why don’t we listen to the experts we asked for advice knowing that this will mean energy is more affordable, more reliable and we will still be able to meet emission reduction commitments under the Paris treaty? | What I am saying to everyone and to the premiers who sit around the table at our meetings; you appointed the energy security board. You appointed them as they are smart and you wanted that advice. They have given us the advice, why don’t we listen to it and follow it? Why don’t we listen to the experts we asked for advice knowing that this will mean energy is more affordable, more reliable and we will still be able to meet emission reduction commitments under the Paris treaty? |
| Meanwhile, Frydenberg told Sky that he reached out to Abbott, who he called a “conscientious objector” on this issue, before the party room to explain the policy to him: | Meanwhile, Frydenberg told Sky that he reached out to Abbott, who he called a “conscientious objector” on this issue, before the party room to explain the policy to him: |
| I did ring him before party room and was upfront about [what the policy can do] and asked him to keep an open mind. | I did ring him before party room and was upfront about [what the policy can do] and asked him to keep an open mind. |
| Labor also looks like having had a Bex and a lie down after being hit with the Coalition policy yesterday and is crafting its response. Expect it to look at the saving aspects – the $110-$115 figure is only an average, which won’t start until 2020, and there is no guarantee to those figures. Just advice the government has been given by the energy security board but, so far, the government can’t show the modelling that points to it. Or guarantee when those savings will kick in. | Labor also looks like having had a Bex and a lie down after being hit with the Coalition policy yesterday and is crafting its response. Expect it to look at the saving aspects – the $110-$115 figure is only an average, which won’t start until 2020, and there is no guarantee to those figures. Just advice the government has been given by the energy security board but, so far, the government can’t show the modelling that points to it. Or guarantee when those savings will kick in. |
| Turnbull is being very cagey on that point and this morning has taken any questioning or scepticism over the figures as “disrespecting” the experts. So that’s going well. | Turnbull is being very cagey on that point and this morning has taken any questioning or scepticism over the figures as “disrespecting” the experts. So that’s going well. |
| In other news, the latest Newspoll shows the yes vote has a commanding lead among people who have already voted in the marriage law postal survey, leading 59% to 38%. | In other news, the latest Newspoll shows the yes vote has a commanding lead among people who have already voted in the marriage law postal survey, leading 59% to 38%. |
| So strap in and get ready for round #3478 in the energy battles. Mike Bowers is prowling the hallways, so follow him at @mpbowers or me at @amyremeikis and have a chat in the comments. I’ll look through them as the day goes on. | So strap in and get ready for round #3478 in the energy battles. Mike Bowers is prowling the hallways, so follow him at @mpbowers or me at @amyremeikis and have a chat in the comments. I’ll look through them as the day goes on. |
| Let’s get started! | Let’s get started! |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 10.39pm BST | at 10.39pm BST |