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Leveson inquiry: Lord Mandelson and Tessa Jowell - live Leveson inquiry: Lord Mandelson and Tessa Jowell - live
(40 minutes later)
10.58am: Allowing Murdoch to buy Channel 5 was "a politically controversial development," says Barr.
Jowell responds: "There are those that would have strong views on either side".
She says she cannot remember whether she spoke to Gordon Brown or other ministers confidentially about sensitive cross-media ownership rules to be proposed by the Communications Act.
We had to see this as intensely politically sensitive, yes. The noise is more politically energising than the substance of the proposals. The important thing was to make sure everyone understood the substance.
Jowell adds that there was a lot of "noise" in the media about the potential for this act to open the door further for Murdoch, but that policy-making was a more rational process.
"I would have had these conversations with these four senior colleagues and taken them through all the proposals. They were more than just lifting the restriction on Channel 5."
10.53am: The Guardian's Dan Sabbagh has just tweeted:
V int point, Blair challenged Jowell on whether Murdochs could buy ITV as Comms Bill was being drafted.
— Dan Sabbagh (@dansabbagh) May 21, 2012
10.52am: News Corporation had lobbied for the removal of 20% ownership bar, Barr says. It was ultimately removed in relation to Channel 5, but not ITV.
Barr wants to explore how this came about.
Neither Rupert Murdoch nor Les Hinton expressed a precise interest in Channel 5, Jowell explains, but warned cross-media ownership rules relaxed across the networks.
Jowell says:
It was a decision reached in the course of the discussion with the prime minister. As I had made clear at the outset I was the secretary of state responsible for taking the decisions but you will see ... that what I was concerned to ensure was if we lifted the 20% restriction and opened up the possibility of a new owner who already had substantial newspapers interests, that we could not get to the point ... where supposing it had been Rupert Murdoch and I want to make it absolutely clear neither he nor Les Hinton had expressed to my recollection a precise interest in Channel 5, they were interested in getting rid of all the cross ownership rules. But the safeguards I wanted to ensure was if C5 exploded from being a tiny terrestrial company Ofcom would be in a position to ensure they took a nominated news provider and they would be in a position to exercise the content control that ITV was accountable to.
Barr asks if Blair's more deregulatory view affected her own position.
"Of course it did because he is the prime minister," Jowell says. "When you are secretary of state and the prime minister has a slightly different view from the one you are advancing you take that seriously."
10.41am: Barr turns to another briefing note, prepared by Jowell and Patricia Hewitt, for Tony Blair in March 2002 on the communications bill. It was followed by a meeting with Blair.
It said that News International and Sky – "not one company but linked in most people's minds" – could also expand into local press and local radio. However, it would be barred from owning ITV or Channel 5 because owned more than 20% of the national newspaper market.
Jowell says she has no specific recollection of the meeting. "The prime minister's instincts were more deregulatory than mine, he pushed me further than I would have gone myself in exploring deregulatory options," she adds.
Barr asks if there was any discussion special adviser level about how this issue might affect the Labour party's relationship with Murdoch.
"No, there was no discussion of that," sha says.
10.37am: Jowells's witness statement has now been published on the Leveson inquiry website.
10.31am: Jowell is asked about her contacts with media groups.
"We invited lobbying from media groups and those representing public interest organisations," Jowell says, adding that she had more than 150 meetings.
10.31am: Barr turns to a briefing note from Jowell to Blair about cross-media ownership.
Anyone who owned more than 20% of the national newspaper market would be precluded from taking a significant stake in Channel 5, Barr says, using the third commercial broadcaster as one example.
In another note on media ownership rules, Jowell told Blair: "we will be accused of giving in to Murdoch but, in fact, there will still be major controls on his activity".
Jowell says she was clear that the government had to retain cross-media ownership rules to prevent "disproportionate control" of the industry.
Although we explored the possibility of further deregulation by getting rid of the 20% rule I disagreed with that, the 20% rule remained," says Jowell.
"I was very clear we had to retain cross media ownership rules in order to prevent the concentration of disproportionate control."
10.24am: News International and other big media groups made clear that competition law alone was sufficient to ensure plurality, Jowell says.
Barr suggests Rupert Murdoch would have been happy with the act's rules on foreign ownership of terrestrial broadcasters.
10.23am: Jowell is asked about foreign ownership of terrestrial broadcasters.
She says she was concerned not to jeopardise quality or plurality of the media while opening up the possibility of US, Japanese or Australian investment in the sector.
10.18am: Jowell says the Department for Culture, Media and Sport also was seeking to consolidate media regulation in one body, Ofcom; deregulate elsewhere; and comply with EU law.
She adds that the DCMS received more than 230 written submissions during its consultation on the Communications Act.
10.16am: Jowell says she wanted to "deregulate" the media without jeopardising the elements that the public valued most.10.16am: Jowell says she wanted to "deregulate" the media without jeopardising the elements that the public valued most.
She wanted to make sure that her proposals "were not being undermined" by media owners going straight to No 10.She wanted to make sure that her proposals "were not being undermined" by media owners going straight to No 10.
Jowell says this was not a concern specific to the media, but acknowledged the "combustible potential" of the act and wanted to limit the noise around her work.Jowell says this was not a concern specific to the media, but acknowledged the "combustible potential" of the act and wanted to limit the noise around her work.
There was always a temptation ... if parties to our policies didn't like the view that was being expressed by the relevant secretary of state they would try to go round the back door to No 10. I was trying to make sure I was the secretary of state solely responsible for bringing forward changes to media regulation.There was always a temptation ... if parties to our policies didn't like the view that was being expressed by the relevant secretary of state they would try to go round the back door to No 10. I was trying to make sure I was the secretary of state solely responsible for bringing forward changes to media regulation.
10.12am: Jowell adds that she received a categorical confirmation from the then prime minister, Tony Blair, that "no deal had been reached" with Rupert Murdoch about new ownership rules.10.12am: Jowell adds that she received a categorical confirmation from the then prime minister, Tony Blair, that "no deal had been reached" with Rupert Murdoch about new ownership rules.
I asked him whether any deal had been done with Rupert Murdoch on the reform of cross-media ownership rules. He gave me an absolute assurance there had been no prior agreement. I had no constraint on the conclusions I might reach … I said, 'In that case it is best that you don't see the parties and you let me take this policy and come back to you with proposals and we can reach agreement.'I asked him whether any deal had been done with Rupert Murdoch on the reform of cross-media ownership rules. He gave me an absolute assurance there had been no prior agreement. I had no constraint on the conclusions I might reach … I said, 'In that case it is best that you don't see the parties and you let me take this policy and come back to you with proposals and we can reach agreement.'
Barr asks if Blair discussed with her how he wanted to deal with Murdoch.Barr asks if Blair discussed with her how he wanted to deal with Murdoch.
"No, he didn't," says Jowell"No, he didn't," says Jowell
10.11am: Jowell is asked about the Communications Act.10.11am: Jowell is asked about the Communications Act.
She says it was one of the particularly pressing issues when appointed to the job, including cross-media ownership rules.She says it was one of the particularly pressing issues when appointed to the job, including cross-media ownership rules.
10.08am: Jowell tells the inquiry there are no longer copies of her ministerial diaries and meeting notes, but she has submitted several documents along with her written witness statement.10.08am: Jowell tells the inquiry there are no longer copies of her ministerial diaries and meeting notes, but she has submitted several documents along with her written witness statement.
10.06am: Tessa Jowell, the former culture secretary, has taken the witness stand.10.06am: Tessa Jowell, the former culture secretary, has taken the witness stand.
David Barr, counsel to the inquiry, is leading questioning of Jowell.David Barr, counsel to the inquiry, is leading questioning of Jowell.
9.46am: Good morning and welcome to the Leveson inquiry live blog.9.46am: Good morning and welcome to the Leveson inquiry live blog.
Lord Mandelson, the long-serving Labour cabinet minister, and the former culture secretary Tessa Jowell will give evidence today.Lord Mandelson, the long-serving Labour cabinet minister, and the former culture secretary Tessa Jowell will give evidence today.
For more than a decade, Mandelson was at the heart of both the Tony Blair and Gordon Brown governments. He served in the cabinet as Northern Ireland secretary from 1999 to 2001, as the business secretary from 2008 to 2010 and as the European commissioner for trade from 2004 to 2008. The former MP for Hartlepool has twice resigned from government.For more than a decade, Mandelson was at the heart of both the Tony Blair and Gordon Brown governments. He served in the cabinet as Northern Ireland secretary from 1999 to 2001, as the business secretary from 2008 to 2010 and as the European commissioner for trade from 2004 to 2008. The former MP for Hartlepool has twice resigned from government.
Tessa Jowell, the serving shadow minister for the Olympics and a victim of phone hacking by the News of the World, will also testify on Monday.Tessa Jowell, the serving shadow minister for the Olympics and a victim of phone hacking by the News of the World, will also testify on Monday.
Jowell was the culture secretary for six years under Blair, from 2001 to 2007. In January 2011, Jowell was told by Scotland Yard she was a phone hacking target in 2006. A year later, Jowell reached an out-of-court settlement with News International, the publisher of the now-defunct Sunday tabloid.Jowell was the culture secretary for six years under Blair, from 2001 to 2007. In January 2011, Jowell was told by Scotland Yard she was a phone hacking target in 2006. A year later, Jowell reached an out-of-court settlement with News International, the publisher of the now-defunct Sunday tabloid.
The inquiry begins at 10am.The inquiry begins at 10am.
Please note that comments have been switched off or legal reasons.Please note that comments have been switched off or legal reasons.