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| Republican debate live: Trump and Bush grapple on night of flared tempers | |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| 3.54am GMT | |
| 03:54 | |
| Trump. | |
| “Politicians are all talk, no action. You’ve seen where they’ve taken you to.” Then moves into his stump “we don’t win” spiel. | |
| “We are not going to be controlled by people that are special interests and lobbyists.” | |
| 3.53am GMT | |
| 03:53 | |
| Ted Cruz. | |
| “Two branches of government hang in the balance. Not just the presidency, but the Supreme Court.” | |
| 3.51am GMT | |
| 03:51 | |
| Now Rubio. | |
| “This is a difficult time for our country. Wrong is now considered right, and right is now considered wrong.” | |
| But 2016 can be a turning-point. That’s why I’m running for president. | |
| 3.50am GMT | |
| 03:50 | |
| Now Bush. | |
| “The next president is going to be confronted with an unforseen challenge ... the question for South Carolinians is: who do you want sitting behind the desk in the Oval Office.” | |
| 3.49am GMT | |
| 03:49 | |
| Carson next. “This is the first generation expected not to do better than their parents. People say this is the new normal, but there’s nothing normal about it.” | |
| Quotes Josef Stalin, which is probably a first, then says “we, the people, can stop that decline.” | |
| Says, in answer to people who says he can’t win: “not only can we win, but we can turn this thing around.” | |
| 3.48am GMT | |
| 03:48 | |
| Time for closing statements | |
| Kasich first, with a strong, positive message. “Whoever gets elected here, hopefully we’ll solve the issue of wages ... but the spirit of America doesn’t come from the top down, the spirit of America rests in us.” | |
| 3.47am GMT | |
| 03:47 | |
| Sent out during the debate, a Bush campaign email is slamming Trump for low-quality products: | |
| Bush campaign email attacks Trump for selling gross vodka, weird-smelling perfume, and uncomfortable mattresses. pic.twitter.com/pRVFU9Ts7x | |
| 3.45am GMT | |
| 03:45 | |
| Final break Twitter roundup: | |
| pic.twitter.com/4gBA4nrXwa | |
| Were they cheering because they LIKED Trump's profanity or because they don't? | |
| "I was a very good student at a great school." -- Donald Trump | |
| trump: my wife often tells me i am wrongmoderator: about what?trump: listen i don't need to be here okay | |
| Trump always interrupts, but no one ever interrupts him | |
| I'm becoming partial to the theory that Trump is only running so he can attack Jeb Bush. #GOPDebate | |
| 3.42am GMT | |
| 03:42 | |
| Rubio is asked if he can talk to any previous president, who would it be and what question would he ask. | |
| Can you guess which president he chooses? | |
| Correct! Ronald Reagan. | |
| Updated | |
| at 3.42am GMT | |
| 3.40am GMT | |
| 03:40 | |
| James Pethokoukis | |
| So what would benefit Republicans more: an extended debate on how to a) increase work, b) raise living standards for low-income Americans and c) increase upward mobility; or that extended, unpleasant exchange between Cruz and Trump? | |
| What would benefit Republicans more: if voters next November knew their anti-poverty plans; or just that they would cut taxes deeply for the 0.1 percent? | |
| And there are Republican anti-poverty plans, from higher-ed reform to increasing wage subsidies to reducing occupation licensing regulations – not that voters watching any of these debates would know about these plans. Rubio gave about 30 seconds on his anti-poverty agenda, which may be it for the entirety of this debate for the entire field. | |
| That’s too bad. | |
| 3.40am GMT | |
| 03:40 | |
| Donald Trump is asked if he’s ever told he’s wrong and listened. “Well my wife tells me I’m wrong,” he says. Then he pivots to attack Jeb Bush’s spending “of special interests’ money” in New Hampshire. “This is not going to make our country great again.” | |
| Jeb has taken a real pounding from Trump tonight. But he is not afforded an opportunity to respond; Dickerson asks Trump another question, about his use of profanity. He claims never to have said “the word” - but that “you bleeped it!” Promises not to do it again, though. | |
| Now, we turn to Bush. “I gotta respond to this.” But Dickerson moves straight to a question, about Washington. “I think the dysfunction in Washington is very dangerous. We need someone who doesn’t disparage people, someone who doesn’t brag about having been bankrupt four times. | |
| Trump interrupts again, a steamroller with a high-electricity haircut. | |
| 3.36am GMT | |
| 03:36 | |
| From our correspondent Ben Jacobs, on the scene: | |
| The media filing center really appreciates Ben Carson speaking because it gives us time to process what people who might be the nominee said | |
| 3.36am GMT | |
| 03:36 | |
| Jeb Lund | |
| This debate is like that playground game in which people blindfold you and spin you around, then whip the blindfold off and see if you can walk somewhere. Only it’s on a moving platform, and the person who is “it” is wearing a mask pumping nitrous oxide. | |
| Anybody who can tell you who won or what just happened or even remember the order of things is lying: this is a mess. It’s a glorious, totally engrossing, chaotic mess, but it’s still a mess. | |
| If you tried to footnote this thing, the job would be longer than the regular text of a David Foster Wallace book. People are just saying damn near anything that pops into their minds. | |
| This isn’t post-truth politics, it’s post-restraint politics. Phineas Gage was more composed than this, and the man had a three-foot iron rod driven through his forebrain. | |
| 3.34am GMT | |
| 03:34 | |
| The best way to get control of the debate is to ask Ben Carson a question. | |
| 3.34am GMT | |
| 03:34 | |
| Things got pretty heated just then, before Ben Carson started talking. | |
| Trump hammering Cruz for lying and saying anything to get elected. Rubio standing back and enjoying the show. | |
| Keeping track at home: Jeb vs Trump, Kasich vs. Bush, Cruz vs Rubio, Jeb vs Trump (again!), Cruz vs Trump, Carson vs. consciousness | |
| 3.32am GMT | |
| 03:32 | |
| “I wanted to look under the hood of the engine of what’s going on in Washington,” says Carson, unprompted, “and I was scared and wanted to run away, but I didn’t.” | |
| 3.29am GMT | |
| 03:29 | |
| “Flexibility is a good thing,” says Cruz. “But you shouldn’t be flexible on core principles.” He says he likes Trump, but points out that the real-estate mogul supports Planned Parenthood. | |
| Trump, rattled, gets mean: “you are the single biggest liar - you’re probably a bigger liar than Jeb Bush.” | |
| “This guy will say anything. Nasty guy.” | |
| Cruz says “Just notice: Donald didn’t disagree with the substance that he supports public funding for Planned Parenthood.” | |
| “Where did I support it, Ted?” shouts Trump. Cruz says he said Trump said - deep breath - that Trump said Planned Parenthood does wonderful things. “It does do wonderful things, just not on abortion,” Trump says, actually rather bravely in this arena. | |
| “My name was mentioned twice,” Ben Carson says, quietly. Everyone ignores him. | |
| 3.27am GMT | |
| 03:27 | |
| James Pethokoukis | |
| I had been wondering if Trump would mention the gut-punch viral video of air conditioner manufacturer laying off some 1400 workers as they moved production facilities to Monterrey, Mexico. | |
| But the larger ramification of what Trump is proposing – taxing any manufacturing moved out of the United States – is that he would theoretically end the offshoring of US manufacturing . Of course, states like South Carolina are also the beneficiaries of other countries placing factories in the United States, particularly foreign automakers, and a trade war would almost certainly impact those facilities. | |
| Voters in those states may understand the economics of trade a bit better than most. | |
| 3.25am GMT | |
| 03:25 | |
| And, we’re back! Once again, first question from the ad break is for Trump. He’s asked about how changing one’s mind is Reaganesque for Trump, and flip-flopping when Rubio does it. | |
| In answer, Trump says that Reagan “made many of the same changes that I made.” | |
| Unforced, he brings up eminent domain, something about which Republican establishment have hit him hard. | |
| 3.22am GMT | 3.22am GMT |
| 03:22 | 03:22 |
| Ad break Twitter roundup: | Ad break Twitter roundup: |
| This debate is getting chippy. What it needs is the calm, steady hand of Jim Gilmore giving it direction. Sigh. | This debate is getting chippy. What it needs is the calm, steady hand of Jim Gilmore giving it direction. Sigh. |
| Ted Cruz has been using the anecdote about his father coming to the US with money in his underwear since college debate | Ted Cruz has been using the anecdote about his father coming to the US with money in his underwear since college debate |
| Wasn't paying attention. Who mooned whom? | Wasn't paying attention. Who mooned whom? |
| Wasn't paying attention. Who mooned whom? | Wasn't paying attention. Who mooned whom? |
| I need a vine of Jeb's face when Trump said the moon thing stat. | I need a vine of Jeb's face when Trump said the moon thing stat. |
| 3.20am GMT | 3.20am GMT |
| 03:20 | 03:20 |
| James Pethokoukis | James Pethokoukis |
| Let’s call the immigration questions the “let’s alienate all non-white” voters portion of the debate. It’s also the part off the debate where – if he were still in the race – Chris Christie would jump in with his “all these senators do is talk about arcane amendments” bit. (It is exactly what Jeb did!) | Let’s call the immigration questions the “let’s alienate all non-white” voters portion of the debate. It’s also the part off the debate where – if he were still in the race – Chris Christie would jump in with his “all these senators do is talk about arcane amendments” bit. (It is exactly what Jeb did!) |
| It was also another squandered opportunity for Trump to walk back his harsh immigration comments from last summer – but that’s not happening. | It was also another squandered opportunity for Trump to walk back his harsh immigration comments from last summer – but that’s not happening. |
| Oh, and does Trump really, really dislike Bush: it’s palpable in way that’s not evident when he talks about Cruz and Rubio. | Oh, and does Trump really, really dislike Bush: it’s palpable in way that’s not evident when he talks about Cruz and Rubio. |
| The Kasich plan to legalize undocumented immigrants without granting citizenship is an interesting middle ground between “deport them all” and the path to citizenship usually derided by Republicans as “amnesty” that might get further exploration if the next president is an Republican – even if that president is not Kasich. | The Kasich plan to legalize undocumented immigrants without granting citizenship is an interesting middle ground between “deport them all” and the path to citizenship usually derided by Republicans as “amnesty” that might get further exploration if the next president is an Republican – even if that president is not Kasich. |
| 3.18am GMT | 3.18am GMT |
| 03:18 | 03:18 |
| A question to Trump, about a promised tax on industries which move abroad, “where do you think you get the authority?” | A question to Trump, about a promised tax on industries which move abroad, “where do you think you get the authority?” |
| “I would build consensus with congress,” promises Trump, Consensus-Builder-In-Chief. “So stay where you are, and build in the United States.” | “I would build consensus with congress,” promises Trump, Consensus-Builder-In-Chief. “So stay where you are, and build in the United States.” |
| 3.17am GMT | 3.17am GMT |
| 03:17 | 03:17 |
| Crucial Trump vs Jeb Bush “mooning” comment update: | Crucial Trump vs Jeb Bush “mooning” comment update: |
| Yes Jeb you did say it: “I could drop my pants. Moon the whole crowd. ...except the press guys would never notice." https://t.co/Ff7s5Umxmf | Yes Jeb you did say it: “I could drop my pants. Moon the whole crowd. ...except the press guys would never notice." https://t.co/Ff7s5Umxmf |
| 3.15am GMT | 3.15am GMT |
| 03:15 | 03:15 |
| The debate so far, summed-up by our very own Ben Jacobs, on the scene in Greenville: | The debate so far, summed-up by our very own Ben Jacobs, on the scene in Greenville: |
| Bush: Screw Trump.Trump: Screw Jeb.Cruz: Screw Rubio.Rubio: Screw Cruz.Kasich: Can't we all just get along?Carson: Go to my website. | Bush: Screw Trump.Trump: Screw Jeb.Cruz: Screw Rubio.Rubio: Screw Cruz.Kasich: Can't we all just get along?Carson: Go to my website. |
| 3.15am GMT | 3.15am GMT |
| 03:15 | 03:15 |
| The Guardian is briefly unable to confirm whether or not Ben Carson is still on the stage. | The Guardian is briefly unable to confirm whether or not Ben Carson is still on the stage. |
| Oh, there he is! He’s asked a question about prosecution of financial executives. | Oh, there he is! He’s asked a question about prosecution of financial executives. |
| “First of all, please go to my website and read my immigration policy,” Carson says in answer, again. | “First of all, please go to my website and read my immigration policy,” Carson says in answer, again. |
| “Because, it actually makes sense!” | “Because, it actually makes sense!” |
| 3.15am GMT | 3.15am GMT |
| 03:15 | 03:15 |
| Megan Carpentier | Megan Carpentier |
| Jeb Bush just stated that Donald Trump is “weak”, because, in part, he callde Senator John McCain “weak”. Trump, of course, denied it. | Jeb Bush just stated that Donald Trump is “weak”, because, in part, he callde Senator John McCain “weak”. Trump, of course, denied it. |
| Well, let the record reflect what Trump did say in July 2015: | Well, let the record reflect what Trump did say in July 2015: |
| He’s not a war hero ... He’s a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren’t captured, OK? I hate to tell you. He’s a war hero because he was captured, OK? And I believe — perhaps he’s a war hero. But right now, he’s said some very bad things about a lot of people. | He’s not a war hero ... He’s a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren’t captured, OK? I hate to tell you. He’s a war hero because he was captured, OK? And I believe — perhaps he’s a war hero. But right now, he’s said some very bad things about a lot of people. |
| And, the week before those comments, he said this: | And, the week before those comments, he said this: |
| I’ve supported John McCain, but he’s very weak on immigration. | I’ve supported John McCain, but he’s very weak on immigration. |
| 3.12am GMT | 3.12am GMT |
| 03:12 | 03:12 |
| “I think we’re fixin’ to lose the election to Hillary Clinton if we don’t stop this,” says John Kasich, Voice Of Reason. | “I think we’re fixin’ to lose the election to Hillary Clinton if we don’t stop this,” says John Kasich, Voice Of Reason. |
| 3.12am GMT | 3.12am GMT |
| 03:12 | 03:12 |
| Trump is now claiming ownership of illegal immigration as a topic. “If I didn’t bring it up, we wouldn’t even be talking about it.” | Trump is now claiming ownership of illegal immigration as a topic. “If I didn’t bring it up, we wouldn’t even be talking about it.” |
| Then he turns the Eye of Sauron on to Jeb. “The weakest person on this stage is Jeb Bush.” | Then he turns the Eye of Sauron on to Jeb. “The weakest person on this stage is Jeb Bush.” |
| “It’s weak to disparage women. It’s weak to denigrate the disabled,” Bush hits back. | “It’s weak to disparage women. It’s weak to denigrate the disabled,” Bush hits back. |
| Trump: “two days ago he said he would take his pants off and moon everybody.” Unconfirmed. | Trump: “two days ago he said he would take his pants off and moon everybody.” Unconfirmed. |