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You can find the current article at its original source at http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2015/aug/12/tony-abbott-says-same-sex-marriage-bill-may-not-come-to-a-vote-politics-live
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| Version 19 | Version 20 |
|---|---|
| Same-sex marriage and emissions target debates dominate parliament – politics live | Same-sex marriage and emissions target debates dominate parliament – politics live |
| (30 days later) | |
| 9.01am BST | 9.01am BST |
| 09:01 | 09:01 |
| Nighty night | Nighty night |
| That will be all for this evening. Fortunately all quiet, no convulsions, just an orderly lurch into Thursday, the final parliamentary day of the week. | That will be all for this evening. Fortunately all quiet, no convulsions, just an orderly lurch into Thursday, the final parliamentary day of the week. |
| Well, we hope so anyway. | Well, we hope so anyway. |
| Thanks again for your company. I can’t actually recall whether I got down into the thread today or not, but in any case thanks for the Politics Live conversation. | Thanks again for your company. I can’t actually recall whether I got down into the thread today or not, but in any case thanks for the Politics Live conversation. |
| Today, Wednesday: | Today, Wednesday: |
| That’s your main points. | That’s your main points. |
| Have a lovely evening. | Have a lovely evening. |
| Let’s do it all again in the morning. | Let’s do it all again in the morning. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.07am BST | at 9.07am BST |
| 8.33am BST | 8.33am BST |
| 08:33 | 08:33 |
| Sinodinos is remarkably frank about the implications for Tony Abbott’s leadership. He says it’s neutral. If you are an Abbott supporter, you’ll go on being that in the wake of this outcome. If you aren’t ... | Sinodinos is remarkably frank about the implications for Tony Abbott’s leadership. He says it’s neutral. If you are an Abbott supporter, you’ll go on being that in the wake of this outcome. If you aren’t ... |
| (It’s possibly about then in the answer when the senator realises his little boat is out quiet a long way. He doesn’t linger on the thought.) | (It’s possibly about then in the answer when the senator realises his little boat is out quiet a long way. He doesn’t linger on the thought.) |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.07am BST | at 9.07am BST |
| 8.30am BST | 8.30am BST |
| 08:30 | 08:30 |
| Q: If you are going to have a plebiscite on this, why not on euthanasia or on climate change? | Q: If you are going to have a plebiscite on this, why not on euthanasia or on climate change? |
| Arthur Sinodinos: | Arthur Sinodinos: |
| That’s a good point. | That’s a good point. |
| He says, well, this is where we’ve ended up. We all had a say. We all can own the outcome. | He says, well, this is where we’ve ended up. We all had a say. We all can own the outcome. |
| 8.28am BST | 8.28am BST |
| 08:28 | 08:28 |
| Liberal senator Arthur Sinodinos is being interviewed on Sky now and is being asked about same-sex marriage. Sinodinos spoke up in favour of marriage equality last night. He confirms he told colleagues: | Liberal senator Arthur Sinodinos is being interviewed on Sky now and is being asked about same-sex marriage. Sinodinos spoke up in favour of marriage equality last night. He confirms he told colleagues: |
| I can’t look a gay person in the eye and say you are children of a lesser god. | I can’t look a gay person in the eye and say you are children of a lesser god. |
| Sinodinos said he wanted a free vote but it’s clear the numbers just aren’t there for change. | Sinodinos said he wanted a free vote but it’s clear the numbers just aren’t there for change. |
| In that sense the outcome was fair. | In that sense the outcome was fair. |
| What does he think of a plebiscite? | What does he think of a plebiscite? |
| It’s beginning to sound very reminiscent of 1999 and the republican debate. | It’s beginning to sound very reminiscent of 1999 and the republican debate. |
| I supported a free vote because I thought it was a good idea to deal with the issue now and get on with other things. | I supported a free vote because I thought it was a good idea to deal with the issue now and get on with other things. |
| I was happy for parliament to have the say but this is where we’ve ended up and I can live with it. | I was happy for parliament to have the say but this is where we’ve ended up and I can live with it. |
| Sinodinos notes that if you support same-sex marriage, it’s time to ramp up the yes campaign. | Sinodinos notes that if you support same-sex marriage, it’s time to ramp up the yes campaign. |
| Time to get busy. | Time to get busy. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.08am BST | at 9.08am BST |
| 7.46am BST | 7.46am BST |
| 07:46 | 07:46 |
| Pyne is however more sanguine about the plebiscite than his colleague Malcolm Turnbull evidently is. He makes the point that the numbers aren’t there in the House of Representatives right now for a yes vote on marriage equality. Pyne thinks the plebiscite might help deliver the result, in effect delivering a yes vote, which then forced the hand of the parliament. He suggests he supported a conscience vote as a matter of principle, not as the only way of skinning the marriage equality cat. | Pyne is however more sanguine about the plebiscite than his colleague Malcolm Turnbull evidently is. He makes the point that the numbers aren’t there in the House of Representatives right now for a yes vote on marriage equality. Pyne thinks the plebiscite might help deliver the result, in effect delivering a yes vote, which then forced the hand of the parliament. He suggests he supported a conscience vote as a matter of principle, not as the only way of skinning the marriage equality cat. |
| 7.42am BST | 7.42am BST |
| 07:42 | 07:42 |
| Christopher Pyne stands by his position that marriage should have gone to the Liberal party room | Christopher Pyne stands by his position that marriage should have gone to the Liberal party room |
| The manager of government business is speaking on Sydney radio. Christopher Pyne isn’t taking a backward step after events yesterday. | The manager of government business is speaking on Sydney radio. Christopher Pyne isn’t taking a backward step after events yesterday. |
| He says is view was the Liberal party should have had a meeting on its own to determine the position on same sex marriage. He says there was absolutely no reason why that couldn’t happen. | He says is view was the Liberal party should have had a meeting on its own to determine the position on same sex marriage. He says there was absolutely no reason why that couldn’t happen. |
| Pyne says the debate yesterday evening uncovered the fact that half the front bench and one third of the backbench supported a free vote. | Pyne says the debate yesterday evening uncovered the fact that half the front bench and one third of the backbench supported a free vote. |
| But a decision was made not to have one. | But a decision was made not to have one. |
| 7.36am BST | 7.36am BST |
| 07:36 | 07:36 |
| I’m sorry I keep talking to people calling by the office. I’m a disgrace to live blogs. | I’m sorry I keep talking to people calling by the office. I’m a disgrace to live blogs. |
| It really is funny isn’t it – the prime minister’s aspirational pitch on the people’s vote on same-sex marriage. I don’t think he’s said once today that he would campaign against it. | It really is funny isn’t it – the prime minister’s aspirational pitch on the people’s vote on same-sex marriage. I don’t think he’s said once today that he would campaign against it. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.09am BST | at 9.09am BST |
| 7.08am BST | 7.08am BST |
| 07:08 | 07:08 |
| Meanwhile, to our south (or to my south anyways), the Victorian Liberal leader Matthew Guy has some choice words for the party leadership in Canberra. | Meanwhile, to our south (or to my south anyways), the Victorian Liberal leader Matthew Guy has some choice words for the party leadership in Canberra. |
| Wake up, Tony – you are spoiling things for all of us. | Wake up, Tony – you are spoiling things for all of us. |
| Matthew Guy: | Matthew Guy: |
| I think Australians are just utterly sick of federal politics and I’m not surprised why. They are poisoning the well of good will for all other elected politicians in the country. | I think Australians are just utterly sick of federal politics and I’m not surprised why. They are poisoning the well of good will for all other elected politicians in the country. |
| People who feel that members should be bound on matters of conscience by a party vote, well, they need to go back and look at the rationale on which our party was founded by Robert Menzies – it wasn’t one of binding votes, it was one of conscience. | People who feel that members should be bound on matters of conscience by a party vote, well, they need to go back and look at the rationale on which our party was founded by Robert Menzies – it wasn’t one of binding votes, it was one of conscience. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 9.09am BST | at 9.09am BST |
| 7.02am BST | 7.02am BST |
| 07:02 | 07:02 |
| Sky News political editor David Speers asks about the costs of abatement. Hunt says the costs between 2018-2030 will be $2.4bn – a very manageable cost. | Sky News political editor David Speers asks about the costs of abatement. Hunt says the costs between 2018-2030 will be $2.4bn – a very manageable cost. |
| Speers points out that assumes the government can achieve abatement at an effective carbon price of $14 a tonne. Will you get abatement at $14 a tonne? Hunt says he wont speculate because it’s a commercial bidding process. | Speers points out that assumes the government can achieve abatement at an effective carbon price of $14 a tonne. Will you get abatement at $14 a tonne? Hunt says he wont speculate because it’s a commercial bidding process. |
| In the event the budget blows out, will the government spend more or will it miss the target? Hunt initially shrugged that off as a hypothetical, then said what the government usually says about this: our expenditure is always on a capped basis. | In the event the budget blows out, will the government spend more or will it miss the target? Hunt initially shrugged that off as a hypothetical, then said what the government usually says about this: our expenditure is always on a capped basis. |
| That means the government won’t spend more. It will miss the target. | That means the government won’t spend more. It will miss the target. |
| Hunt was asked about policies keeping to pledges on 2 degrees warming. He said the UN-led talks in Paris won’t tie everything off. He says the world could undertake another pledging round in five years. | Hunt was asked about policies keeping to pledges on 2 degrees warming. He said the UN-led talks in Paris won’t tie everything off. He says the world could undertake another pledging round in five years. |
| Speers asks when the government will reveal penalties for business who pollute too much. Hunt said the government will release a paper on that in the coming weeks. | Speers asks when the government will reveal penalties for business who pollute too much. Hunt said the government will release a paper on that in the coming weeks. |
| Q: Will the penalties be serious? | Q: Will the penalties be serious? |
| There are provisions to deal with rogue emitters. | There are provisions to deal with rogue emitters. |
| Q: Financial penalties? | Q: Financial penalties? |
| Yes. | Yes. |
| But he adds the system is about meaningful baselines and safeguards, not about punishments. | But he adds the system is about meaningful baselines and safeguards, not about punishments. |
| 6.47am BST | 6.47am BST |
| 06:47 | 06:47 |
| Environment minister Greg Hunt is on Sky News, trying to steer the conversation back to emissions reduction that won’t club the economy. | Environment minister Greg Hunt is on Sky News, trying to steer the conversation back to emissions reduction that won’t club the economy. |
| He references the United States target but more precisely than the prime minister – Australia has the same headline cut, but on a different time frame. | He references the United States target but more precisely than the prime minister – Australia has the same headline cut, but on a different time frame. |
| 6.25am BST | 6.25am BST |
| 06:25 | 06:25 |
| A journey of ignorance and hate to acceptance and love | A journey of ignorance and hate to acceptance and love |
| I didn’t get to share this before question time, but it’s a contribution well worth your time this afternoon. The Labor MP Tim Watts today shared a story of his Uncle Derek, who died of Aids in rural Queensland in the 1980s. | I didn’t get to share this before question time, but it’s a contribution well worth your time this afternoon. The Labor MP Tim Watts today shared a story of his Uncle Derek, who died of Aids in rural Queensland in the 1980s. |
| Watts told the chamber his plan was to contribute a very clinical speech in support of same-sex marriage, but his plans changed when he read the government Senate leader Eric Abetz’s characterisation of gay men during yesterday’s marathon same-sex marriage debate. | Watts told the chamber his plan was to contribute a very clinical speech in support of same-sex marriage, but his plans changed when he read the government Senate leader Eric Abetz’s characterisation of gay men during yesterday’s marathon same-sex marriage debate. |
| Believe it or not, not all gay men are Italian fashion designers. | Believe it or not, not all gay men are Italian fashion designers. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 8.03am BST | at 8.03am BST |
| 6.12am BST | 6.12am BST |
| 06:12 | 06:12 |
| Labor’s climate spokesman Mark Butler persists on the modelling. | Labor’s climate spokesman Mark Butler persists on the modelling. |
| Q: It’s been reported today that government modelling shows that an emissions target of 45% reduction would mean a cut of between 0.5% and 0.7% of GDP. Does the prime minister still stand by the answer he just gave? | Q: It’s been reported today that government modelling shows that an emissions target of 45% reduction would mean a cut of between 0.5% and 0.7% of GDP. Does the prime minister still stand by the answer he just gave? |
| Butler is referring to Lenore Taylor’s story this morning that I linked to earlier in the day. She’s seen the as-yet unreleased modelling. | Butler is referring to Lenore Taylor’s story this morning that I linked to earlier in the day. She’s seen the as-yet unreleased modelling. |
| Here’s Lenore: | Here’s Lenore: |
| The government’s modelling showed that the 26% target would shave between 0.2% and 0.3% from Australian GDP in 2030, but the same modelling found a 35% target would cut only 0.3% to 0.5% and a 45% target would cut between 0.5% and 0.7%. (The modelling looked at the costs of doing no more after the 2020 target was reached, and of cutting by 26% by 2030, by 25% and by 45%.) | The government’s modelling showed that the 26% target would shave between 0.2% and 0.3% from Australian GDP in 2030, but the same modelling found a 35% target would cut only 0.3% to 0.5% and a 45% target would cut between 0.5% and 0.7%. (The modelling looked at the costs of doing no more after the 2020 target was reached, and of cutting by 26% by 2030, by 25% and by 45%.) |
| This is obviously quite different to the 2% Abbott just referenced in his answer to Plibersek. Abbott avoids the contradiction by talking about other modelling commissioned by the former Labor government and throws in a “Carbon Bill” for good measure. | This is obviously quite different to the 2% Abbott just referenced in his answer to Plibersek. Abbott avoids the contradiction by talking about other modelling commissioned by the former Labor government and throws in a “Carbon Bill” for good measure. |
| Further questions have been placed on the notice paper. | Further questions have been placed on the notice paper. |
| 6.04am BST | 6.04am BST |
| 06:04 | 06:04 |
| I note the interwebz is fired up about this terrific chamber shot from Mike Bowers of the treasurer Joe Hockey. | I note the interwebz is fired up about this terrific chamber shot from Mike Bowers of the treasurer Joe Hockey. |
| .@rs200077 @BrettLeeRetired @mpbowers @murpharoo @GuardianAus @sports_banter @On_Da_Ball #qt pic.twitter.com/ZXfAKkeJZS | .@rs200077 @BrettLeeRetired @mpbowers @murpharoo @GuardianAus @sports_banter @On_Da_Ball #qt pic.twitter.com/ZXfAKkeJZS |
| @BrettLeeRetired @mpbowers @RedJules4 @murpharoo @GuardianAus @sports_banter @On_Da_Ball Token Joe the new Pavarotti pic.twitter.com/BA2knK8dqC | @BrettLeeRetired @mpbowers @RedJules4 @murpharoo @GuardianAus @sports_banter @On_Da_Ball Token Joe the new Pavarotti pic.twitter.com/BA2knK8dqC |
| But I need to sprint back to modelling, quick sticks. | But I need to sprint back to modelling, quick sticks. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 6.10am BST | at 6.10am BST |
| 6.00am BST | 6.00am BST |
| 06:00 | 06:00 |
| Labor’s Tanya Plibersek wants to know if the prime minister stands by another statement in the House yesterday: that his government’s modelling shows a 40% cut results in a cut to GDP of 2%? | Labor’s Tanya Plibersek wants to know if the prime minister stands by another statement in the House yesterday: that his government’s modelling shows a 40% cut results in a cut to GDP of 2%? |
| The prime minister says he does, yes. | The prime minister says he does, yes. |
| 5.55am BST | 5.55am BST |
| 05:55 | 05:55 |
| Is aspiration a target? | Is aspiration a target? |
| Shorten asks the prime minister will he apologise for misleading the House yesterday when he said Australia’s post-2020 target was the same as America’s when the US target is about 40%, not 26-28%? | Shorten asks the prime minister will he apologise for misleading the House yesterday when he said Australia’s post-2020 target was the same as America’s when the US target is about 40%, not 26-28%? |
| Speaker Smith would like misleading withdrawn because there are other forms of the House for dealing with such matters. | Speaker Smith would like misleading withdrawn because there are other forms of the House for dealing with such matters. |
| Shorten drops misleading. | Shorten drops misleading. |
| Abbott digs in as he answers. | Abbott digs in as he answers. |
| The United States has no target beyond 26 to 28%. | The United States has no target beyond 26 to 28%. |
| My understanding is the US has a two-tier target. The US has said it will reduce greenhouse emissions by 26% to 28% below 2005 levels in 2025 and aim for an 80% reduction by 2050. | My understanding is the US has a two-tier target. The US has said it will reduce greenhouse emissions by 26% to 28% below 2005 levels in 2025 and aim for an 80% reduction by 2050. |
| The first tier involves action more quickly than the Australian road map. Perhaps the prime minister doesn’t regard aspiration as targets? | The first tier involves action more quickly than the Australian road map. Perhaps the prime minister doesn’t regard aspiration as targets? |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 6.12am BST | at 6.12am BST |
| 5.46am BST | 5.46am BST |
| 05:46 | 05:46 |
| If you won’t rule out increasing the GST, why did you promise 33 times not to increase the GST? | If you won’t rule out increasing the GST, why did you promise 33 times not to increase the GST? |
| This question is from Labor’s Tony Burke to Tony Abbott. The prime minister says any increase will go to the voters at an election. Why don’t you join the conversation, the prime minister says. The jobs and growth conversation. | This question is from Labor’s Tony Burke to Tony Abbott. The prime minister says any increase will go to the voters at an election. Why don’t you join the conversation, the prime minister says. The jobs and growth conversation. |
| Funny, Wayne Swan used to have that same conversation all the time he was in treasury portfolio in the previous Rudd and Gillard governments. | Funny, Wayne Swan used to have that same conversation all the time he was in treasury portfolio in the previous Rudd and Gillard governments. |
| Jobs and growth. Same mantra. | Jobs and growth. Same mantra. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 6.13am BST | at 6.13am BST |
| 5.42am BST | 5.42am BST |
| 05:42 | 05:42 |
| Put down the props, Speaker Smith says. On the seat. | Put down the props, Speaker Smith says. On the seat. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 6.14am BST | at 6.14am BST |