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You can find the current article at its original source at https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2016/oct/18/malcolm-turnbull-rejects-amnesty-claim-that-detention-akin-to-torture-politics-live
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| Malcolm Turnbull says there is 'no chance' of Coalition watering down gun laws – question time live | Malcolm Turnbull says there is 'no chance' of Coalition watering down gun laws – question time live |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| 6.13am BST | |
| 06:13 | |
| I just want to step back and summarise this gun debate because it is quite complex. Granted, everyone has had a crack at summarising but this is my version. | |
| So there are two issues: | |
| This has allowed many straw men to flourish. | |
| The National Firearms Agreement - or the Howard gun laws - will still be in place, no matter what the outcome for the Adler. Because this is the framework for the gun laws. | |
| This means that the government can say rightly they are still committed to the Howard gun laws. | |
| But if the Adler is allowed in on the lowest category - as Leyonhjelm wants - there will be a more lethal weapon available to ordinary shooters. | |
| 5.23am BST | 5.23am BST |
| 05:23 | 05:23 |
| Paul Karp | Paul Karp |
| AHRC president Gillian Triggs is being asked about complaints made under s18C of the Racial Discrimination Act in Senate estimates. | AHRC president Gillian Triggs is being asked about complaints made under s18C of the Racial Discrimination Act in Senate estimates. |
| Triggs notes that s18D provides an exemptions for works that are done reasonably and in good faith. Those include fair and accurate reports or comments, and publications with a “genuine academic, artistic or scientific purpose”. Triggs notes that protects cartoons. | Triggs notes that s18D provides an exemptions for works that are done reasonably and in good faith. Those include fair and accurate reports or comments, and publications with a “genuine academic, artistic or scientific purpose”. Triggs notes that protects cartoons. |
| Senator David Fawcett asks why the AHRC doesn’t throw out unmeritorious complaints quicker to prevent a chilling effect on speech. | Senator David Fawcett asks why the AHRC doesn’t throw out unmeritorious complaints quicker to prevent a chilling effect on speech. |
| Triggs replies: | Triggs replies: |
| We have no decision-making power, we are not a judicial body … We have an obligation under the statute to consider the matter and conciliate the complaint. | We have no decision-making power, we are not a judicial body … We have an obligation under the statute to consider the matter and conciliate the complaint. |
| She said if parliament doesn’t like it, it can change the act. | She said if parliament doesn’t like it, it can change the act. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 5.31am BST | at 5.31am BST |
| 5.22am BST | 5.22am BST |
| 05:22 | 05:22 |
| The Fixer. | The Fixer. |
| Nicely placed folder by Cathy McGowan. Ten points for product placement. | Nicely placed folder by Cathy McGowan. Ten points for product placement. |
| 5.20am BST | 5.20am BST |
| 05:20 | 05:20 |
| 5.15am BST | 5.15am BST |
| 05:15 | 05:15 |
| The votes continued. Plibersek is shut down. Now a procedural vote before the substantial motion. | The votes continued. Plibersek is shut down. Now a procedural vote before the substantial motion. |
| 5.12am BST | 5.12am BST |
| 05:12 | 05:12 |
| To be clear: | To be clear: |
| The house just voted to gag Shorten. That vote passed. | The house just voted to gag Shorten. That vote passed. |
| The house is now voting to gag Tanya Plibersek. | The house is now voting to gag Tanya Plibersek. |
| 5.04am BST | 5.04am BST |
| 05:04 | 05:04 |
| Labor suspends standing orders on the gun laws issue. | Labor suspends standing orders on the gun laws issue. |
| The house votes... | The house votes... |
| 5.03am BST | 5.03am BST |
| 05:03 | 05:03 |
| Every government question apart from the one to Joyce on water has been on the CFMEU, the ABCC and Labor links ... | Every government question apart from the one to Joyce on water has been on the CFMEU, the ABCC and Labor links ... |
| The immigration minister, Peter Dutton, goes furthest. | The immigration minister, Peter Dutton, goes furthest. |
| The fact is Labor renewed the visa of a bikie in this country who was known to be involved in organised crime. There are links between the Labor party, the CFMEU and outlawed motorcycle gangs. That is indisputable. These people are accepting money from the CFMEU in the millions of dollars. The CFMEU supports the bikies because the bikies provide the muscle on building sites. These facts can’t be disputed. | The fact is Labor renewed the visa of a bikie in this country who was known to be involved in organised crime. There are links between the Labor party, the CFMEU and outlawed motorcycle gangs. That is indisputable. These people are accepting money from the CFMEU in the millions of dollars. The CFMEU supports the bikies because the bikies provide the muscle on building sites. These facts can’t be disputed. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 5.07am BST | at 5.07am BST |
| 5.00am BST | 5.00am BST |
| 05:00 | 05:00 |
| Shorten to Turnbull: Can the prime minister confirm that he has spoken directly to Senator Leyonhjelm about the ban on the lever-action Adler shotgun? Has he seen reports that Senator Leyonhjelm has told Sky News that the prime minister was willing to discuss the regulation of the Adler gun in connection with support for the ABCC legislation? | Shorten to Turnbull: Can the prime minister confirm that he has spoken directly to Senator Leyonhjelm about the ban on the lever-action Adler shotgun? Has he seen reports that Senator Leyonhjelm has told Sky News that the prime minister was willing to discuss the regulation of the Adler gun in connection with support for the ABCC legislation? |
| Unlike the honourable member who just asked me this question, I respect all of the senators. | Unlike the honourable member who just asked me this question, I respect all of the senators. |
| Turnbull goes through the history again and then ends with this: | Turnbull goes through the history again and then ends with this: |
| Senator Leyonhjelm has a view about what that classification should be and he is entitled to that view. He’s entitled to express it to me or to any other minister. But what he has not proposed, at least not in my hearing, is any weakening of the National Firearms Agreement as it stands. He has a view as to the manner in which it should be strengthened. He is entitled to have that view as indeed are other shooter organisations and their representatives. The government, of course, listens to those views as I’m sure justice ministers and premiers in other jurisdictions do as well. | Senator Leyonhjelm has a view about what that classification should be and he is entitled to that view. He’s entitled to express it to me or to any other minister. But what he has not proposed, at least not in my hearing, is any weakening of the National Firearms Agreement as it stands. He has a view as to the manner in which it should be strengthened. He is entitled to have that view as indeed are other shooter organisations and their representatives. The government, of course, listens to those views as I’m sure justice ministers and premiers in other jurisdictions do as well. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 5.08am BST | at 5.08am BST |
| 4.51am BST | 4.51am BST |
| 04:51 | 04:51 |
| How to win friends and influence people, starring Ian Macdonald | How to win friends and influence people, starring Ian Macdonald |
| Paul Karp | Paul Karp |
| Senator Ian Macdonald is grilling the Australian Human Rights Commission’s Gillian Triggs about her commentary that politicians are “ill-informed”. | Senator Ian Macdonald is grilling the Australian Human Rights Commission’s Gillian Triggs about her commentary that politicians are “ill-informed”. |
| MacDonald has accidentally called Triggs “senator” several times, then, as an aside, remarks that it is because she would fit into the category of the “ill-informed”. | MacDonald has accidentally called Triggs “senator” several times, then, as an aside, remarks that it is because she would fit into the category of the “ill-informed”. |
| Labor senators ask him to withdraw the remark but he refuses. When Labor senators argue Macdonald is badgering the witness, he replied: | Labor senators ask him to withdraw the remark but he refuses. When Labor senators argue Macdonald is badgering the witness, he replied: |
| It’s typical of the left that when you’re trying to question somebody they object at every opportunity.” | It’s typical of the left that when you’re trying to question somebody they object at every opportunity.” |
| Greens senator Nick McKim moves for the committee to suspend, prompting attorney general George Brandis to remark it is a “standard technique of the left”. | Greens senator Nick McKim moves for the committee to suspend, prompting attorney general George Brandis to remark it is a “standard technique of the left”. |
| The motion is put to a vote and it is tied three-all. MacDonald uses his casting vote to continue the hearing. | The motion is put to a vote and it is tied three-all. MacDonald uses his casting vote to continue the hearing. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 5.08am BST | at 5.08am BST |
| 4.47am BST | 4.47am BST |
| 04:47 | 04:47 |
| Shorten to Keenan: I refer to the Minister’s previous answer where he explained that the only influence for lifting the ban on rapid fire lever action shotguns after 12 months was the negotiation with the States. Why then was he offering or his office was offering the sunset clause in return to secure votes in the Senate on completely unrelated legislation? | Shorten to Keenan: I refer to the Minister’s previous answer where he explained that the only influence for lifting the ban on rapid fire lever action shotguns after 12 months was the negotiation with the States. Why then was he offering or his office was offering the sunset clause in return to secure votes in the Senate on completely unrelated legislation? |
| Same answer. | Same answer. |
| 4.42am BST | 4.42am BST |
| 04:42 | 04:42 |
| Labor gets down to the Keenan-Leyonhjelm deal. | Labor gets down to the Keenan-Leyonhjelm deal. |
| Labor to Keenan: I refer to this email from your office to Senator Leyonhjelm’s office dated 12 August 2015 at 10.36am that confirms the minister and minister Dutton on behalf of the Coalition government agree to insert a sunset clause on the banning of particular lever action shotguns in exchange for Senator Leyonhjelm’s support in the Senate. Does the minister consider it acceptable that he was prepared to trade off John Howard’s gun laws in order to secure support for legislation in the Senate? | Labor to Keenan: I refer to this email from your office to Senator Leyonhjelm’s office dated 12 August 2015 at 10.36am that confirms the minister and minister Dutton on behalf of the Coalition government agree to insert a sunset clause on the banning of particular lever action shotguns in exchange for Senator Leyonhjelm’s support in the Senate. Does the minister consider it acceptable that he was prepared to trade off John Howard’s gun laws in order to secure support for legislation in the Senate? |
| Keenan: | Keenan: |
| The government has always been 100% clear in our position that we will restrict their import until we get an agreement with the States about where they were to be classified. I would very much like that conversation was concluded within those 12 months but it wasn’t so we’ve subsequently extended the ban until we reach that agreement. It is very straightforward. | The government has always been 100% clear in our position that we will restrict their import until we get an agreement with the States about where they were to be classified. I would very much like that conversation was concluded within those 12 months but it wasn’t so we’ve subsequently extended the ban until we reach that agreement. It is very straightforward. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 5.09am BST | at 5.09am BST |
| 4.37am BST | 4.37am BST |
| 04:37 | 04:37 |
| Dixer to Barnaby Joyce: What is the government doing to ensure all Australians, including the great Australians in Mallee, that they have access to reliable water supply? Is the minister aware of any threats to the delivery of reliable water infrastructure? | Dixer to Barnaby Joyce: What is the government doing to ensure all Australians, including the great Australians in Mallee, that they have access to reliable water supply? Is the minister aware of any threats to the delivery of reliable water infrastructure? |
| 4.33am BST | 4.33am BST |
| 04:33 | 04:33 |
| Andrew Wilkie, independent, asks Turnbull: | Andrew Wilkie, independent, asks Turnbull: |
| Ray Williams was a peacekeeper in Beirut during the civil war. He was shot at and shelled but had no weapon, body armour or support. He suffers PTSD. Remarkably Ray has been fighting for 18 years to have his service recognised as warlike. Yes, there is a review into service ... but it has been going for years and will likely outlive the veterans. Prime minister, do you agree everyone injured or wounded in the ADF, wherever they’ve served, should be given the same high level of support and will you stop the bureaucratic nonsense, order the UNSO review finalised and help veterans like Ray Williams? | Ray Williams was a peacekeeper in Beirut during the civil war. He was shot at and shelled but had no weapon, body armour or support. He suffers PTSD. Remarkably Ray has been fighting for 18 years to have his service recognised as warlike. Yes, there is a review into service ... but it has been going for years and will likely outlive the veterans. Prime minister, do you agree everyone injured or wounded in the ADF, wherever they’ve served, should be given the same high level of support and will you stop the bureaucratic nonsense, order the UNSO review finalised and help veterans like Ray Williams? |
| Turnbull says the review will be completed later this year. | Turnbull says the review will be completed later this year. |
| I want to reassure the honourable member and all veterans that the Department of Veterans’ Affairs will continue to look after them. That is our obligation. | I want to reassure the honourable member and all veterans that the Department of Veterans’ Affairs will continue to look after them. That is our obligation. |
| But the PM does not answer the question about the substance – that is will all veterans be treated the same in terms of support. | But the PM does not answer the question about the substance – that is will all veterans be treated the same in terms of support. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 4.43am BST | at 4.43am BST |
| 4.30am BST | 4.30am BST |
| 04:30 | 04:30 |
| Labor to the justice minister, Michael Keenan: Since coming to office in 2013, has the minister ever offered to weaken Australia’s gun laws for support in the Senate? | Labor to the justice minister, Michael Keenan: Since coming to office in 2013, has the minister ever offered to weaken Australia’s gun laws for support in the Senate? |
| Just pause there so that I can give you another quote from David Leyonhjelm: | Just pause there so that I can give you another quote from David Leyonhjelm: |
| When I protested, I was told by minister Keenan we never intended to allow that into the country anyway. So in other words the agreement was made in bad faith. So I have made my displeasure known to the government ever since August this year. It has been two months since I was aware that they had no intention of sticking by the agreement. I have whinged at them on occasional ... They are well aware of my displeasure. And now, all of a sudden, they want my support on the ABCC bill. | When I protested, I was told by minister Keenan we never intended to allow that into the country anyway. So in other words the agreement was made in bad faith. So I have made my displeasure known to the government ever since August this year. It has been two months since I was aware that they had no intention of sticking by the agreement. I have whinged at them on occasional ... They are well aware of my displeasure. And now, all of a sudden, they want my support on the ABCC bill. |
| In answer to the Labor question, Keenan goes through the timeline Turnbull did earlier. | In answer to the Labor question, Keenan goes through the timeline Turnbull did earlier. |
| But he does not touch on the earlier deal with Leyonhjelm. | But he does not touch on the earlier deal with Leyonhjelm. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 4.45am BST | at 4.45am BST |