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Impeachment hearings: Sondland says quid pro quo was pushed by Giuliani and ordered by Trump - live Impeachment hearings: Sondland says quid pro quo was pushed by Giuliani and ordered by Trump - live
(32 minutes later)
The US ambassador to the EU has delivered bombshell testimony that deals serious blows to Trump’s defense of his role on UkraineThe US ambassador to the EU has delivered bombshell testimony that deals serious blows to Trump’s defense of his role on Ukraine
Who’s planning on following up their day of impeachment viewing with a night of debate excitement? Some politically pregnant clashes about probably impossible health care plans brewing, friend-of-the-blog Sabrina Siddiqui reports for the Wall Street Journal:
Note that we are now about a half hour beyond the scheduled start time of the second set of witnesses to appear today, Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs David Hale and Laura Cooper, Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for Russia, Ukraine, Eurasia.
The Sondland testimony, now six hours and counting, has overflowed all bounds of expectation.
Democrats are playing the Mulvaney news conference in which he said military aid was being held up to get “investigations” out of Ukraine and then told people to “get over it”.
Democrat Joaquin Castro asks if it’s appropriate for the president to ask a foreign country to investigate a political rival.
“The president should not investigate a political rival in return for a quid pro quo,” Sondland said.
Democrat Eric Swalwell asks Sondland about Trump’s statement today, “This is not a man I know well.”
Q: Is that true?
A: “It really depends on what you mean by know well. We are not close friends. We have a professional, cordial working relationship.”
Swalwell notes Sondland said he spoke with Trump about 20 times, then turns to Sondland’s status as a Trump megadonor.
Q: “You gave $1m to his inauguration, right?”
A: “I bought a VVIP ticket to the inauguration.”
Q: “That’s a lot of money, right?
A: “That’s a lot of money.”
There’s a quality poll out in the swing state of Wisconsin that looks – quite good – for Trump:
Trump won last time in part by unexpectedly sweeping the supposed “blue wall” states of Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania.
Here’s video of the Pinochios moment:Here’s video of the Pinochios moment:
A preponderance of testimony points to what Sondland today has testified, that “everyone was in the loop” on attempts to broker a deal with Ukraine that would produce an announcement of investigations including of Joe Biden.A preponderance of testimony points to what Sondland today has testified, that “everyone was in the loop” on attempts to broker a deal with Ukraine that would produce an announcement of investigations including of Joe Biden.
Republicans have all day been trying to walk on roller skates into gale-force winds on this, thumping the table over Sondland’s testimony that Trump never explicitly told him that aid was conditioned on investigations.Republicans have all day been trying to walk on roller skates into gale-force winds on this, thumping the table over Sondland’s testimony that Trump never explicitly told him that aid was conditioned on investigations.
But as Sondland testified, “I would have been more surprised if President Trump had not mentioned investigations,” on the 26 July call they shared, “particularly given what we were hearing from Mr. Giuliani about the President’s concerns.”But as Sondland testified, “I would have been more surprised if President Trump had not mentioned investigations,” on the 26 July call they shared, “particularly given what we were hearing from Mr. Giuliani about the President’s concerns.”
Speier and Conaway are arguing about a Washington Post piece that undercuts Schiff’s assertion that the whistleblower has a statutory right to anonymity.Speier and Conaway are arguing about a Washington Post piece that undercuts Schiff’s assertion that the whistleblower has a statutory right to anonymity.
The Post gave the assertion three Pinnochios! Conaway says.The Post gave the assertion three Pinnochios! Conaway says.
Speier retorts: “The president of the United States has five Pinnochios on a daily basis so let’s not go there.”Speier retorts: “The president of the United States has five Pinnochios on a daily basis so let’s not go there.”
The public audience laughs and claps. The president, such a liar, amiriteThe public audience laughs and claps. The president, such a liar, amirite
Sondland is asked about reprisals from his testimony.Sondland is asked about reprisals from his testimony.
He says he and his family have been threatened, in the form of “countless emails to my wife. Our properties are being picketed and boycotted.”He says he and his family have been threatened, in the form of “countless emails to my wife. Our properties are being picketed and boycotted.”
Republican Mike Conaway then accuses Democrat Earl Blumenauer of Oregon, who called for the Sondland boycott, of using his congressional power to “bully and threaten” Sondland.Republican Mike Conaway then accuses Democrat Earl Blumenauer of Oregon, who called for the Sondland boycott, of using his congressional power to “bully and threaten” Sondland.
Democrat Jackie Speier detects some irony in the Republican warning about bullying: “All we’re talking about is the president bullying to get something that he wants done.”Democrat Jackie Speier detects some irony in the Republican warning about bullying: “All we’re talking about is the president bullying to get something that he wants done.”
Not only did the president explicitly say there was no quid pro quo – he never said he was bribing the Ukrainians. See?!Not only did the president explicitly say there was no quid pro quo – he never said he was bribing the Ukrainians. See?!
Schiff draws chuckles:
“My colleagues seem to be under the impression that unless the president spoke the words, ‘I am bribing the Ukrainian president,’ that there’s no evidence of bribing,” Schiff says.
He also critiques the Republican argument that because Ukraine got the military aid there was never a condition on it.
“Yes,” says Schiff. “They got caught. They got caught.”
Sondland says he “strongly disagrees” with Kurt Volker, who testified yesterday that he, Volker, was not sure that the White House meeting was conditioned on an announcement of investigations:
Republican Mike Turner is after Sondland:
Q: “Is Donald Trump your friend?”
A: “No we’re not friends.”
Q: “Do you like the president?”
A: “Yes.”
Turner explains that media headlines are depicting his testimony as damning for Trump.
Turner challenges Sondland: you don’t have any evidence that aid was tied to the investigations, do you?
Sondland replies: “Other than my own presumption.”
Turner snaps: “Which is nothing!... you do not have any evidence that the president of the United States was tied to withholding aid in exchange for investigations.”
By all accounts Sondland was up to this neck in brokering the back-channel deal in Ukraine, so his account of what was being negotiated seems like not “nothing.”
Here Giuliani gives voice to what a lot of people are thinking (that sounds Trumpian doesn’t it?) – although apart from Giuliani it’s mostly critics of Trump who are saying it: Steve Castor, the lawyer for the Republicans, is not having the strongest day.
Giuliani tweets that Castor “doesn’t do his own research and preparation”:
Republican Jim Jordan gets his turn early. He’s off and running/yelling. His argument is that because there was never a deliverable – a White House meeting – that means was never an attempt to procure a deliverable, the so-called quid pro quo. As if it’s not possible that the attempted deal dissolved under light of the impeachment inquiry. He is making the argument at volume.
Sondland is asked whether he believes the president does not give a “fig” – Sondland is quoted elsewhere saying “shit” – about Ukraine:
“I think that’s too strong,” Sondland says. “The president was down on Ukraine for the reasons mentioned and would need a lot of convincing.”
Democrat Jim Himes now. He asks what Giuliani told Sondland to establish that he, Giuliani, was expressing the desires of Trump. Sondland says Volker told him that Giuliani spoke for Trump.
Of course Trump himself told Zelenskiy to coordinate on investigations of Joe Biden with Giuliani. And he told all the amigos in the Oval Office on 23 May to “talk to Rudy.”
We’re back. Republican John Ratcliffe is talking. He’s zeroing in on the bit of Sondland’s testimony in which he recounts a phone call in which Trump – after the whistleblower complaint had been filed – told Sondland he did not want a quid pro quo in Ukraine.
The Department of Energy has issued a statement saying Sondland “misrepresented” both secretary Rick Perry’s interaction with Rudy Giuliani and “direction the Secretary received from President Trump.” It continues:
On a notepad with the header “Aboard Air Force One”, Trump appears to have been transcribing Sondland’s testimony:
When he was first asked about Trump’s 25 July call with Zelenskiy, which he was listening to, secretary of state Mike Pompeo feigned ignorance of the call.
Pompeo has just professed ignorance of testimony by Sondland, who read emails revealing that Pompeo was in the loop on the Ukraine plot: