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Sir Philip Green: 'stupid and idiotic' decisions made over BHS - live updates
Sir Philip Green: 'stupid and idiotic' decisions made over BHS - live updates
(35 minutes later)
2.31pm BST
14:31
Green looks like he might mislay his rag, when asked to clarify his commitment to BHS pensioners.
We covered that five and half hours ago, he says, before repeating that he will meet with the pension regulator and try to agree a deal.
Sir Philip still being v truculent "I answered that 5 1/2 hours ago. Can we get to the end?"
2.29pm BST
14:29
Green also explains that he wasn’t prepared to support a £60m loan from investment group Gordon Brothers which Chappell had lined up in the final days before BHS went under.
It was a “loan to own”, says Green, as BHS would have breached it quickly.... meaning Gordon Brothers would have walked away with the business.
Updated
at 2.32pm BST
2.27pm BST
14:27
Q: Dominic Chappell told us that he was shocked that you sold the BHS Ealing branch to your stepson, and he flipped it for a £3.5m profit. Is that true?
I wasn’t involved in that deal, Green replies. It wasn’t my transaction.
Q: But did you know about it?
Green doesn’t give a particularly clear answer, but indicates he was aware the property was being sold.
Q: Is it true that you initially told the regulator that you had not sold any assets to any interested parties, and then had to correct it once the Ealing sale came to light?
Is which bit true, asks Green?
Q: That you initially told the regulator that you had not sold any assets to any interested parties, and then had to correct it?
Green says he doesn’t know.
Green says doesn't know if he was asked by regulator that he said he hadn't sold anything to linked parties..
Q: Well, could you help us check?
Green says this line of questioning is “ludicrous”.
"Check whatever you like. It's ludicrous" - Green says when asked about impact of Ealing deal on pensions regulator probe. Blustering
2.17pm BST
14:17
Green: I didn't want BHS to fail.
Q: Did you have regular talks to Chappell about weekly sales?
No, says Green. Chappell wouldn’t know what they were.
Q: And you sold him the company...
Don’t remind me, Green grimaces.
And he jokes:
If you look Dominic Chappell up in the dictionary it says “very optimistic”
Q: Do what did you talk to Chappell about?
I didn’t want to the business to fail, Green insists, so he acted as a sounding board for Chappell’s ideas.
Green also disses Chappell’s claims to be a property expert, saying he failed to cut a better deal with landlords.
Chappell was also too slow to arrange the CVA [Company Voluntary Arrangement] which trimmed BHS’s rent costs, Green adds. That stubbornness undermined the chances of turning BHS around.
Updated
at 2.19pm BST
2.14pm BST
14:14
Testament to how good the Nokia 6310 battery life is... Sir Philip Green still has one as his phone... #BHS pic.twitter.com/GC0Na5Yr6O
2.11pm BST
14:11
Green now wants the committee clerk to stop whispering to MPs during the session.
2.10pm BST
14:10
It looks like Green uses an old-school Nokia handset...
The most shocking revelation of this Select Committee has just surfaced. I believe Philip Green still uses a Noka phone in this day and age.
2.08pm BST
14:08
Suddenly, a mobile phone rings, disrupting the session....and it’s Sir Phil’s!
Apologies, he says, I forgot to turn it off.
It‘s the pensions regulator, jokes Iain Wright.
2.06pm BST
14:06
The committee are back again for the final part of the session.
Sir Philip Green seems quite chirpy still - maybe he can see the finishing line in sight.
Jeremy Quin MP asks about the charges that he retained on BHS after selling it, which meant Arcadia was a preferred creditor.
Green says that out of £256m of debt, £216m was written off when BHS was sold and a £40m charge was retained.
He says that he also agreed to released a fixed charge on one property, to help the new owners raise more money
Q: So you had an umbilical connection...
I’m sorry, I can’t accept that, Green interrupts, showing that thin-skinned side again.
1.44pm BST
1.44pm BST
13:44
13:44
OK, the committee are taking another quick break for a vote, but they will be back shortly.
OK, the committee are taking another quick break for a vote, but they will be back shortly.
Green would happily have finished the session right then.
Green would happily have finished the session right then.
1.44pm BST
1.44pm BST
13:44
13:44
Green is arguing that he didn’t realise that Chappell was unreliable...
Green is arguing that he didn’t realise that Chappell was unreliable...
Green says Chappell was supposed to put £10m of equity into BHS and "he didn't put any in"
Green says Chappell was supposed to put £10m of equity into BHS and "he didn't put any in"
Green: "I did not know the sort of costs this guy was running up with advisers etc. I did not know until 4 was ago his £5m equity was a loan
Green: "I did not know the sort of costs this guy was running up with advisers etc. I did not know until 4 was ago his £5m equity was a loan
1.37pm BST
13:37
Green says one of the “lovely journalists in the room” contributed to BHS’s demise, by undermining Chappell’s credibility each weekend.
Those articles made it impossible to get credit insurance for BHS, he claims.
I’m pretty sure he means Oliver Shah of the Sunday Times, who has swiftly responded:
Green blames a "lovely journalist" for stopping Chappell get credit insurance. Perhaps he should take responsibility for selling to Chappell
Suspect Green thought he could suppress Chappell/Sutton stories by bullying the press, as he tries to do numerous times wth Sunday Times
Updated
at 1.38pm BST
1.34pm BST
13:34
Green: Chappell "breached covenants" over BHS deal
Onto another curious property deal, the sale of North West House (a BHS asset sold in 2015).
Green says that it was sold to £32m, but only £25m showed up in the BHS accounts. Arcadia were told that remaining £7m had been transferred to the Bank of China, to help set up a £100m loan.
He says that the £7m then arrived at Chappell’s lawyers, Olswang. But £1.2m was then paid to Olswang, £1.2m to Grant Thornton, £1.8m to Chappell himself....
This, Green declares. means that Chappell breached a covenant which Arcadia had made him sign, to not take money out of the business (as our Sarah Butler reported earlier this month)
Green: angry about MPs not focusing on "blatent breach" of protective covenants by Chapell transfer of £7m proceeds from BHS property sale
Philip Green alleges that Chappell took £7m from sale of BHS offices after claiming he had put it into Bank of China bank account
1.25pm BST
13:25
MP: Does Green have a corporate governance problem?
Philip Green is getting ill-tempered again, as the committee ask how he compensated Chappell for the £8.5m profit that he didn’t get on the Marylebone House deal.
He keep trying to sweep away questions he doesn’t like the sound of.
And Iain Wright MP has spotted a pattern - suggesting that Green’s Arcadia Group has a serious corporate governance problem.
That’s your opinion, Green says.
If you behaves like this in a parliamentary committee, it must be hard for directors to raise concerns at an Arcadia board meeting, suggests Richard Fuller MP.
I’m choosing to ignore that, says Green.
Ian Wright says to Green "We're asking the questions" Then Green says he doesn't like way MP asking question.. getting v bad tempered
You've complained about way questions put to you "Is that way you deal with your directors?' says MP. Green: I'm choosing to ignore that
1.19pm BST
13:19
Green confirms that he had planned to sell Marylebone House, BHS’s HQ, to Chappell for £35m.
[This is a crucial point; Chappell had taken a £35m loan from the Dellal family of property investors, and was planning to sell it onto them for £45m].
Green suggests he didn’t originally know Chappell was planning to turn a quick profit; even though £8.5m of profits from the deal appear on the BHS term sheet.
Q: So why did you change your mind and sell Marylebone House to someone else?
Once word spread in the property market that we were selling it, we received better offers and realised it was worth more, Green replies.
But....
Marylebone House was owned by Wilton Equity, an offshore group owned by Green’s wife Lady Tina. And it emerged last week that the property was actually sold by Wilton, to Arcadia, reportedly yielding a profit of £21m.
"This has got nothing to do with BHS" Green says over sale of Marylebone House, BHS offices, which netted £53m for Lady Green
1.09pm BST
13:09
The committee are now turning to the financial help which Sir Philip Green provided to Dominic Chappell’s Retail Acquisitions to help the BHS purchase go through.
MP Quin says much of the cash Green left on BHS's balance sheet was "delusional" including proceeds from sale of Carlisle store
Labour’s Richard Fuller says that Chappell’s term sheet, which claimed to have £120m of funding, actually only had £40m. So how did Green not spot the problems?
Green repeats that he wasn’t involved in the sale until he’d been convinced that Chappell was genuine.
Q: So is it a fair observation that a “wrong ‘un” got through the system because you relied on advisers for all the detail?
That’s your observation, Green replies.
But again, he’s spreading the blame to other people...while claiming he’s not blaming anyone.....
MP: term sheet masquerading a £40mn loan as £120mn
1.00pm BST
13:00
Iain Wight then calls Green up for his refusal to say if any of his executives raised any concerns about the Chappell deal.
You seem a dominant character, but also extraordinarily thin-skinned when asked quite courteous questions, Sir Philip ....
This seems to prick the Arcadia boss:
Iain Wright: Green seems extraordinarily thin skinned to simple questions. "Like what!!!" Green says, somewhat proving his point
Wright’s point is that some Arcadia lieutenants might have been scared to raise a red flag to the Chappell deal.
12.58pm BST
12:58
Green adds that “unfortunately, we found the wrong guy” when they sold BHS to Dominic Chappell. What happened subsequently is “beyond horrible”.
12.54pm BST
12:54
Green: I wouldn't do Chappell deal again
Iain Wright MP tries to pin Green down.
Q: Was good corporate governance followed in the sale of BHS?
We’re going this again, Green asks, incredulously.
He says that Arcadia put good people on the sale -- they should have been able to do the right deal.
Q: Are you still happy with Lord Grabiner (Arcadia’s chairman, who didn’t attend the meeting where BHS was sold)?
Yes, Green insists. Grabiner is highly capable, and highly respected...
“was”, chips in one MP. Grabiner’s reputation has changed, Sir Philip....
Green concedes that he shouldn’t have sold BHS to Chappell, but insists that advisers -- both his and Chappell’s – are to blame.
Would I do that deal again, no. Am I sorry we did that deal, yes.
12.51pm BST
12:51
Richard Graham MP calls up Green about his claim that Chappell lives in Fantasy Land...
..I never said that, claims Green, astonishingly.
Yes you did, the MPs chorus. It’ll be in the record (and the liveblog, five short minutes ago)
Graham then tries to put another question about the decision to sell BHS with an unresolved pension deficit, and Green isn’t happy at all. He repeats that he’s going to find a solution, and blames the pension regulator.
Sir, the regulator has never called me! Do you want me to write down my mobile phone number and email so you can pass it on?
Sir Phil kicking off.Richard Graham suggests he sold BHS to get rid of pension liability."withdraw that"pretty obvious question to me.
Updated
at 12.55pm BST
12.46pm BST
12:46
Green is now dishing out fashion advice to Jeremy Quin.
Green now telling MP to put glasses back on "you look better with your glasses on" - really don't think baiting MPs going to help him
